US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Move2CLT]

Typical AWA spin - this is only partially correct.

You might have been able to talk Parker into giving you some form of profit sharing in the transition agreement; but, if the US Airways MEC (Pollock was the deciding vote) had not voted to give the AWA pilots a portion of the profit sharing which had been designated for the EAST US Airways in LOA 93, you would not have received any of that percentage of the profit sharing. Period - no matter how much you spin it.

So yes - the profit sharing that was supposed to go to the US Airways east pilots was absolutely diluted (gutted) to extend a hand of good will to the AWA pilots. We all know how much good that did us....

Boeing Driver

Completely inaccurate. Once again, we negotiated the profit sharing ourselves for ourselves. The east had nothing to do with it.

 

[Move2CLT]

Bull Honky. WE (that would be all three parties) agreed to the transition agreement tenets (insert ...."it's ALPA's fault" sob story here). The West MEC did not oppose pay parity, BUT Mr. Parker told you (and told you, and told you, and told Scott to tell you, and told you, and told you again.....) that your pay parity would arrive in the fashion of a jointly negotiated contract. Your AAA JNC members along with the company and the west JNC members had around 27 (I believe) CLOSED sections of a 30-some section contract when they were instructed (insert..."it's ALPA's fault" sob story here) to depart from the JNC table when the Nicolau Arbitrated seniority list was delivered to ALPA.

I'm sorry it's a sore subject, but that does not entitle you to special treatment. Get your facts straight. Get your group to "man up" and bargain, negotiate and run a union like a REAL collective bargaining agent and you might just retire with something other than LOA 93. We "westies" tire of the East's incessant crying "foul". You have had 6 years 4 months since the merger announcement, 5 years 11 months since the merger completion, 4 years 3 months to recover from the "travesty of the Nicolau Award", and 3 years 4 months since USAPA was voted in with nary one of its promises being kept.

Now that's a great post.

 

[mrbreeze]

Completely inaccurate. Once again, we negotiated the profit sharing ourselves for ourselves. The east had nothing to do with it.

Ahh, a simple case of Parker blowing smoke up your arse. At the time of the merger, Parker forced the East MEC into a vote of yes, agreeing to expand profit sharing to the West pilots, or vote no.....fighting Parker over profit sharing. With the devisive East MEC, the vote was tied....Pollock cast the tie breaker, allowing West pilots to profit from what we had given up via LOA93.

The East pilots were also being forced into a position of accepting parity only if it included the NIC.....nothing to consider there.....

 

[Move2CLT]

Parker forced?!?!? Just how did Parker "force" a yes vote?

And parity was never on the table. It was made clear (and it's still true today) by Parker that the only avenue to parity was via a new contract. Parity via the TA was a non- starter. You guys didn't fight for it because if Parker walked away from the merger, your airline would have liquidated. You guys were stuck with no leverage and were in no position to give us anything.

The west negotiated profit sharing because we could have walked away from the merger and nothing would have changed for us. Profit sharing costs the company nothing unless it makes money. It was a whole lot cheaper for the company to give to us because there was no upfront cost. Unlike parity for you.

Amazing these conspiracy theories that you guys come up with. Laughable.

BTW, is Claxon for real?

 

[Boeing Driver]

Completely inaccurate. Once again, we negotiated the profit sharing ourselves for ourselves. The east had nothing to do with it.

It was a vote (tie breaker by Pollock) by the US Airwasy MEC, prior to the transition agreement being signed, that allowed the 36% profit sharing that was supposed to go to the East pilots to be shared with the West. The AWA pilots did not "negotiate" this. You may not like it (we sure as hell don't) but that is exactly what happened.

It is only one of the reasons why Pollock will be totally worthless and ineffectual in the PHL CP office - no one has any respect for him and will not listen to him.

How do you know when an AWA pilot is spinning? Ans. = His lips are moving.

Boeing Driver

 

[Move2CLT]

No, it's not.

And what happened to being forced? You guys need to get your fiction straight.

 

[luvn737s]

So when Parker says he'll only give parity through a joint contract, he's a villain, but when Bradford said he wouldn't pursue the west's rights to section 6 negotiations, he's a champion of labor?

 

[USA320Pilot]

Boeing Driver said: "You might have been able to talk Parker into giving you some form of profit sharing in the transition agreement; but, if the US Airways MEC (Pollock was the deciding vote) had not voted to give the AWA pilots a portion of the profit sharing which had been designated for the EAST US Airways in LOA 93, you would not have received any of that percentage of the profit sharing. Period - no matter how much you spin it. So yes - the profit sharing that was supposed to go to the US Airways east pilots was absolutely diluted (gutted) to extend a hand of good will to the AWA pilots. We all know how much good that did us...."

USA320Pilot comments: Boeing Driver's statement is inaccurate. Following US Airways emergence from bankruptcy Profit Sharing was provided by the Transition Agreement and negotiated by the Airline Parties (US Airways, AAA MEC, and AWA MEC). Profit Sharing was not diluted (gutted) to extend a hand of good will to the AWA pilots. Furthermore, all of US Airways' operation is combined and profits are generated by the combined business entity.

 

[Move2CLT]

Thank you. No one gave anyone anything.

 

[Barrister]

Bull Honky. WE (that would be all three parties) agreed to the transition agreement tenets (insert ...."it's ALPA's fault" sob story here). The West MEC did not oppose pay parity, BUT Mr. Parker told you (and told you, and told you, and told Scott to tell you, and told you, and told you again.....) that your pay parity would arrive in the fashion of a jointly negotiated contract. Your AAA JNC members along with the company and the west JNC members had around 27 (I believe) CLOSED sections of a 30-some section contract when they were instructed (insert..."it's ALPA's fault" sob story here) to depart from the JNC table when the Nicolau Arbitrated seniority list was delivered to ALPA.

I'm sorry it's a sore subject, but that does not entitle you to special treatment. Get your facts straight. Get your group to "man up" and bargain, negotiate and run a union like a REAL collective bargaining agent and you might just retire with something other than LOA 93. We "westies" tire of the East's incessant crying "foul". You have had 6 years 4 months since the merger announcement, 5 years 11 months since the merger completion, 4 years 3 months to recover from the "travesty of the Nicolau Award", and 3 years 4 months since USAPA was voted in with nary one of its promises being kept.

The East doesn't "recover"from NIC moron...have you not been
keeping up!!!

NICDOA
NPJB

 

[A320 Driver]

Boeing Driver said: "You might have been able to talk Parker into giving you some form of profit sharing in the transition agreement; but, if the US Airways MEC (Pollock was the deciding vote) had not voted to give the AWA pilots a portion of the profit sharing which had been designated for the EAST US Airways in LOA 93, you would not have received any of that percentage of the profit sharing. Period - no matter how much you spin it. So yes - the profit sharing that was supposed to go to the US Airways east pilots was absolutely diluted (gutted) to extend a hand of good will to the AWA pilots. We all know how much good that did us...."

USA320Pilot comments: Boeing Driver's statement is inaccurate. Following US Airways emergence from bankruptcy Profit Sharing was provided by the Transition Agreement and negotiated by the Airline Parties (US Airways, AAA MEC, and AWA MEC). Profit Sharing was not diluted (gutted) to extend a hand of good will to the AWA pilots. Furthermore, all of US Airways' operation is combined and profits are generated by the combined business entity.

The 36% profit sharing was provided to the East pilots in the Transition Agreement LOA 93 in the FIRST bankrupcy. It was extended in the AWA/AAA Transition Agreement LOA 96 to the West pilots at our expense in the SECOND bankrupcy.

For God's sake, can't you read? It's in black and white. Enough already. The East pilot group is STILL under LOA 93. That 36% didn't magically transfer to cover the West pilots without the agreement of the East MEC.

Driver <_<

 

[Boeing Driver]

USA320Pilot comments: Boeing Driver's statement is inaccurate. Following US Airways emergence from bankruptcy Profit Sharing was provided by the Transition Agreement and negotiated by the Airline Parties (US Airways, AAA MEC, and AWA MEC). Profit Sharing was not diluted (gutted) to extend a hand of good will to the AWA pilots. Furthermore, all of US Airways' operation is combined and profits are generated by the combined business entity.

As usual USA320Pilot is providing misleading information.

The original 36% profit-sharing provision was contained in LOA 93 for the East pilots, NOT the transition agreement. This 36% profit sharing was intended to attempt to be a form of compensation for the pay the East pilots were giving up.

AWA pilots did not have ANY profit sharing in their contract at the time.

The East MEC vote to include the AWA pilots in the profit sharing language of the transition agreement as a measure of goodwill towards the AWA pilots was deadlocked. I very clearly remember Pollocks explanation as to why he cast the tie breaking vote.

No amount of misinformation and spin changes these facts,

Boeing Driver

 

[No Land Green]

As usual USA320Pilot is providing misleading information.

The original 36% profit-sharing provision was contained in LOA 93 for the East pilots, NOT the transition agreement. This 36% profit sharing was intended to attempt to be a form of compensation for the pay the East pilots were giving up.

AWA pilots did not have ANY profit sharing in their contract at the time.

The East MEC vote to include the AWA pilots in the profit sharing language of the transition agreement as a measure of goodwill towards the AWA pilots was deadlocked. I very clearly remember Pollocks explanation as to why he cast the tie breaking vote.

No amount of misinformation and spin changes these facts,

Boeing Driver

Is USA320Pilot the person who runs Ultimate Bull Feces dot Org?

 

[Iclubbabyseals]

Is USA320Pilot the person who runs Ultimate Bull Feces dot Org?

Yes.

 

[A320 Driver]

As usual USA320Pilot is providing misleading information.

The original 36% profit-sharing provision was contained in LOA 93 for the East pilots, NOT the transition agreement. This 36% profit sharing was intended to attempt to be a form of compensation for the pay the East pilots were giving up.

AWA pilots did not have ANY profit sharing in their contract at the time.

The East MEC vote to include the AWA pilots in the profit sharing language of the transition agreement as a measure of goodwill towards the AWA pilots was deadlocked. I very clearly remember Pollocks explanation as to why he cast the tie breaking vote.

No amount of misinformation and spin changes these facts,

Boeing Driver

He just has to read. Unfortunantly, both documents LOA 93 and LOA 96 are BOTH titled "Transition Agreement". Probably went over his head.

Driver