US Pilots Labor Discussion

[767jetz]

Reality check. It was the east pilots that failed to bargain in good faith DURING the N/M/A phase. It was the east pilots that failed to accept after the results. It was the east pilots that have cost this pilot group hundreds of millions in delaying the contract.

No, No, NO! Stop bringing facts and truth to bear on this situation. The only thing that matters is the part where the west refused to allow the east to impose their will on the them. 😉

 

[IADair]

No, No, NO! Stop bringing facts and truth to bear on this situation. The only thing that matters is the part where the west refused to allow the east to impose their will on the them. 😉

Facts we dont need no stinking facts

 

[cleardirect]

Sounds like the merger of lines will be by the time stamp(DOH) on you ticket.

Sounds like you are wrong. It will be your position in your line.

 

[aquagreen73s]

“There is no compromise left” is a ridiculous statement. It was attitudes like that that caused the Wye River effort to fail and ALPA to lose the election to USAPA. And for there to be no combined CBA four years after the merger. A great track record of success.

No. It was the morons from the East who showed up with the "better take quasi-DOH or else USAPA is coming."

We chose option two.

USAPA didn't deliver for you.

You're screwed.

Enjoy LOA93

Clowns.

 

[aquagreen73s]

As told to me by an East Merger Committee member, the West didn't care about Monda, it was Colello they were concerned about. Hence we are where we are today. "Keep your eye on the prize", what exactly does that mean in the eye's of a West Pilot.....I think we all know the answer on the East side.

Yeah.


USAPA has failed.

Time to go to Hail Mary plan 3, the Teamster.

LOA93 as far as the eye can see.

Reality lives.

That's the answer on the East.

 

[767jetz]

Maybe the east did make the first mistake.

Maybe?? Not maybe. The east did exactly that. But at least you are admitting where the problem "maybe" started.

But when the West was sat down by ALPA and told to compromise at WYE, they walked

Seriously??? This is the attitude that causes your problems in the first place. What are they, children in the 3rd grade? So they were "sat down and TOLD" what to do. What makes you think you or anyone in ALPA can TELL anyone what to do? No one had the right to TELL anyone what to do. Except the courts maybe. And that is yet to be determined.

Speaking of which, did you ever consider where you would be today if the UA acquisition of US had happened in 2000? (Yes it was an acquisition, not a merger. US was literally being bought with our cash from an ESOP company, where we had veto rights on the BOD, and every right to negotiate a pre-nup.) Don't get me wrong. I thank Heaven that it fell apart. But it was this EXACT attitude of "telling everyone how it's going to be" when you have no right to, that precipitated the collapse of that acquisition. Yet then as today, you guys are always so quick to blame the rest of the world for your problems.

Stand in your separate corners and yell your useless slogans, “date of hire” “Nicolau Award”–or solve the dispute. Without that, the dispute looks like it will go on and on.[/i][/size]

And as you and many others have said, you are fine with the separate ops and LOA93 forever. So why the THOUSANDS of pages arguing over what you claim to accept? It's fine to continue hoping for a win with Kasher. But thinking it has more than a slight chance of going your way, as some seem to claim here, is certainly more wishful thinking than a good probability.

 

[767jetz]

So if I go to Wendy's I can't be served till you are at McDonald's? I, and anyone behind me at Wendy's, have to twiddle out thumbs till you're served at MickeyDee's? If, by some twist of fate, I get served first I have to give you my burger since you were in a line at a different burger joint first? "Interesting" logic...

At least you're admitting what you really want - the west to get nothing till the east gets everything it wants... :blink:

Jim

Please allow me to modify your analogy. Its not McDonalds. It was more like an Arby's store that was closing up shop. Arby's was out of burgers and had nothing but fries left. They even sent a thousand patrons out to the curb with an IOU for a burger just in case they miraculously found some more beef. Now the customers still in the store were given a relative slot over at Wendy's, which was better than nothing. The ones with the IOU were allowed to redeem those at Wendy's. But that's not enough for the Arby's customers. They want the Wendy's customers to step outside and hand over their burgers to the poor Arby's souls who are on the street.

 

[aquagreen73s]

Bottom line, it's very easy to explain the West's case, with or without burger analogies. It was easy in Addington and that resulted in a unanimous jury verdict within two hours of deliberations - barely enough time to even elect a foreman.

The story hasn't changed. DFR II has a very very very good chance at success. The company knows this and won't deal on seniority. LOA93 and an injunction will wrap the situation up as far as the company is concerned. We can sit here and just retire off enough on the East to move forward. In the meantime, the company saves billions.

 

[luvthe9]

"Should you win" At least you are admitting t is not a lock. Whatever it takes to bring us up. Right. I will hold my breath for that to happen. Since for the last 3.5 years usapa had been able to accomplish nothing. I fully expect that record to continue.

As I have said before Clear, IF we win we need to get you guys up the whatever the higher pay will be, and more than likely you westies will need to take it up a notch to help us help you. Now you know that's not a popular comment as I have said before the way you guys were to us when parity was discussed.

 

[Move2CLT]

Just how were we to you when parity was discussed?

 

[BoeingBoy]

Facts we dont need no stinking facts

That is rather obvious...

Jim

 

[Pi brat]

Please allow me to modify your analogy. Its not McDonalds. It was more like an Arby's store that was closing up shop. Arby's was out of burgers and had nothing but fries left. They even sent a thousand patrons out to the curb with an IOU for a burger just in case they miraculously found some more beef. Now the customers still in the store were given a relative slot over at Wendy's, which was better than nothing. The ones with the IOU were allowed to redeem those at Wendy's. But that's not enough for the Arby's customers. They want the Wendy's customers to step outside and hand over their burgers to the poor Arby's souls who are on the street.

The problem with your analogy is that the "Arby's" store NEVER CLOSED. It's property, other assets and customers went to the new owners and proved to be a better franchise than the "Wendys".

You don't get to see the crew news sessions. In the most recent one Parker says with conviction that AWA would have been in Chp 11 and on the path of Frontier by the end of 2005, even sooner than I imagined.

It was a merger of two also ran, headed to death airlines that saved both. It shouldn't have matter which would have died first.

 

[Move2CLT]

The problem with your analogy is that the "Arby's" store NEVER CLOSED. It's property, other assets and customers went to the new owners and proved to be a better franchise than the "Wendys".

You don't get to see the crew news sessions. In the most recent one Parker says with conviction that AWA would have been in Chp 11 and on the path of Frontier by the end of 2005, even sooner than I imagined.

It was a merger of two also ran, headed to death airlines that saved both. It shouldn't have matter which would have died first.

$315M in the bank. We were no where near C11. And look at how long you guys floundered in C11. The news of our impending demise was greatly exaggerated.

 

[BoeingBoy]

The company knows this and won't deal on seniority.

Small correction - not without court ordered immunity from legal liability, which I don't personally think they'll get.

Jim

 

[Pi brat]

$315M in the bank. We were no where near C11. And look at how long you guys floundered in C11. The news of our impending demise was greatly exaggerated.

Go watch the Sept. CLT F/A crew news session, "Who saved whom", and learn something.

It's so funny how you guys quote and hang on Parker's every word, except for those.

This merger integration has been delayed long enough to see which assumptions were correct.