US Pilots Labor Discussion

[mrbreeze]

Well, I was using your words, so that's understandable...

Jim

My words? that makes less sense than your last post, sorry I don't get it.

breeze

 

[BoeingBoy]

Argueing facts and splitting hairs don't always pan out, do they?

Not if you don't have the facts to start with...ya still think Republic is hankering to buy an "unprofitable" PHX operation to add to it's unprofitable DEN operation?

Jim

 

[BoeingBoy]

Dupe - Jim

 

[BoeingBoy]

My words? that makes less sense than your last post, sorry I don't get it.

And I even quoted those words... Guess I'll have to again, with emphasis this time.

Like a hub, PHX originates little money but like a parasite...

So according to you, PHX - like a hub - originates very little money...etc. Are not CLT and PHL hubs? Would not your statement that hubs originate little money...parasite...etc thus apply to them. If I say "The earth, like other planets, revolves around the sun" am I not also saying that the other planets revolve around the sun?

Jim

 

[mrbreeze]

Dupe - Jim

Owners of Republic are agressive fellows and I wouldn't be surprised to see them make a run at PHX, just to expand. they would then take the West pilots down to a Republic contract.

It's not about profit to them at this point, it's about market share and getting extablished. Profits are on down the road.

breeze

 

[BoeingBoy]

Then explain the obligation to become a minor holder of F9...seems the opposite of growth to me...

And they'd take the westies down to a Republic contract like they did the F9 pilots? Oh, that's right - the F9 pilots make more than the westies (payscale wise).

I know it's some eastie's wet dream, but it just doesn't make sense.

Jim

 

[nic4us]

Clear,

ever consider the idea that Republic would like to buy the West operation? Expansion opportunity......throwing you guys into the seniority mix being suffered by the Midwest/Frontier pilots? You guys want to be slotted....well, there ya go....exactly what you have wanted all along.

Honestly, give some thought to that and how it would effect you.

breeze

Breeze,

The problem with you an luv9's fragmentation fantasies are many, but the biggest single obstacle is, there is no West operation to sell.

 

[mrbreeze]

And I even quoted those words... Guess I'll have to again, with emphasis this time.



So according to you, PHX - like a hub - originates very little money...etc. Are not CLT and PHL hubs? Would not your statement that hubs originate little money...parasite...etc thus apply to them.

Jim

Big difference....no Intl connections in PHX....originating traffic, who cares? the big game these days is in Star Alliance.

breeze

 

[BoeingBoy]

there is no West operation to sell.

I assume that they really mean fragmentation - selling planes, facilities, etc with presumably the employees necessary to operate those assets going along if they chose to. But no one can explain why Republic would be trying to get out of one money-losing operation only to get into a bigger "money-losing" (so they say) operation.

Jim

 

[mrbreeze]

Then explain the obligation to become a minor holder of F9...seems the opposite of growth to me...

And they'd take the westies down to a Republic contract like they did the F9 pilots? Oh, that's right - the F9 pilots make more than the westies (payscale wise).

I know it's some eastie's wet dream, but it just doesn't make sense.

Jim

Adjusting paychecks are a minor issue that is on the back burner at this point.....they just want to expand......just like the losses, wages are to be dealt with in the future.

breeze

 

[BoeingBoy]

Big difference....no Intl connections in PHX....originating traffic, who cares? the big game these days is in Star Alliance.

So now you're changing your words...let's see...intl connections and *A resulted in what? Two bankruptcies in 3 years? Quite the powerhouse...

Jim

 

[mrbreeze]

I assume that they really mean fragmentation - selling planes, facilities, etc with presumably the employees necessary to operate those assets going along if they chose to. But no one can explain why Republic would be trying to get out of one money-losing operation only to get into a bigger "money-losing" (so they say) operation.

Jim

Jim,

I am just speculating......it's all I can do to fly a jet and am definitaely not an airline manager. I do know that the Star Alliance and similar contracts are a life line to differnet airlines. republic is a minor player with big dreams IMHO.

Who knows what the future holds.....unless, of course, you truely can see the future. 😉

breeze

 

[mrbreeze]

So now you're changing your words...let's see...intl connections and *A resulted in what? Two bankruptcies in 3 years? Quite the powerhouse...

Jim

You lost me on changing my words.....I think you may have confused me with someone elses words.

 

[BoeingBoy]

Nope, can't see the future. Just read about what's going on and try to make logical conclusions. Like Republic. I agree that they were a relatively minor player with big aspirations. Like whoever it was that tried the "being an independent big boy" under the Independence Air brand (failed) and Midway (failed). It seems that now that Republic has had a taste of trying to make the transition to "one of the big boys" it didn't like it so is going back to the all-but-guaranteed profits of a fee-for-departure express operator. That's after having all the benefits to help make the transition - Frontier was in BK so Republic got it cheap, along with a place (the only one) to fly the 190's. It appears that they're going to keep just enough of a stake in F9 to guarantee the fee-for-departure arrangement. After all, the various fee-for-departure contracts have been making up for F9's losses since Republic bought them.

Sorry, but I just don't see the logic of Republic taking a second bite of that worm-infested apple with what easties claim is a "parasite", and pay a higher price to do it since US isn't in bankruptcy. Republic is sitting on a pot of gold - 140+ Ejets, the largest fleet of them in the world with more on order. Which are in demand as the majors upsize their express fleet. Why in the world would Republic want to one "money losing" mainline-type operation for another?

Jim

 

[BoeingBoy]

You lost me on changing my words.....I think you may have confused me with someone elses words.

Nope - I keep quoting your words that I'm responding to. You first claimed that hubs essentially don't contribute to profitability - they may even lose money. Until I pointed out that PHL/CLT are hubs. Then it's "Oh, CLT and PHL are different. I didn't mean those hubs."

Ironically, you've inadvertently identified the fallacy in the "split off the west" theory - connections. Look at all the feed into the system from the western U.S. that PHX provides - multiples of what just the few western cities served non-stop from PHL/CLT supply. Split off the west and you lose that feed. Lose that feed and the east is right back to where it was during the bankruptcies - losing money. So the wet dream of splitting off the west is really the east's worst nightmare.

Jim