US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Move2CLT]

Now this is some great work.

http://youtu.be/hKJL9uJOsRY

 

[luvn737s]

Not so sure about him bludgeoning the East Unions. I do agree he would have tried and tried mightily.

I have no doubt. While Parker wipes away every sniffle the east has out of fear (that was before the injunction for the very thing he feared and couldn't prevent by molly-coddling), Franke was old-school and the only thing he feared was running out of cash, although I could hardly imagine him begging the ATSB for money. Not his style. Lay off half the work force? Now that was more his style.

I think as Parker matures and becomes emboldened (relative to an extremely weak pilot union, I suppose) he will adopt a more hard-line stance and the pilots will become even more like outside contractors, albeit with a lousy contract.

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

AirTran MEC Chairman Special Message: November 7, 2011

November 7, 2011

Fellow Pilots,

It is decided. The Seniority Integration Agreement has been approved. With an 83.58 percent vote of the ATN pilots and an 83.56 percent vote of the SWAPA pilots – both in favor of ratification – our collective hands have extended and accepted Southwest’s offer as to how the pilot groups will be merged. As such, the next few weeks will be busy as we start the process of combining flight operations. The momentum of this integration will accelerate in the coming months and before long our last pilot will have made the transition to Southwest Airlines. Once a phoenix rising, AirTran Airways will have flown its final flight.

Before we look to the future, however, we must take time to recognize the contributions that the ATN pilots have made to AirTran Airways. We helped build an airline from scratch, and then rebuilt it again and again. The AirTran of 2011 is distinctly different from its precursors in 1993 and even from itself in 2001.Through it all, we remained steadfast in our dedication to the success of the company and the professional execution of our duties. These traits, our core ideals, set the foundation for a high quality experience from a low-fare carrier. By exceeding the expectations of both our passengers and our most ardent opponents, AirTran, perpetually the underdog, succeeded in the face of intense competition.

Similarly, through most of its 40-year history, Southwest and its employees were also underdogs. They were fortunate, however, to have the visionary leadership of Herb Kelleher and Colleen Barrett, who encapsulated the “Southwest Way:” a Warrior Spirit, a Servant’s Heart and a Fun-LUVing attitude. They created a whole corporate department to foster and preserve this culture, while we had to adopt these principles organically. We did it in a vacuum, amongst ourselves, because we knew that our future as airline pilots was dependant on the success of a business over which we had little control. This is our identity – professionals in the face of adversity.

Even now, we have sacrificed to ensure the success of the company. But, by ratifying this agreement, we, along with SWAPA pilots, have taken ownership of our pilot integration and the future of Southwest Airlines. From Portland, Maine to Portland, Oregon, Southwest Airlines will extend a reach only imagined when it began flying its first Dallas to Houston and San Antonio legs in 1971. CEO Gary Kelly has also spoken of his desire to push even further: to Mexico, Canada, Alaska and Hawaii. The synergies unleashed by the merger of our two airlines will power this expansion with nearly eight thousand pilots at the helm. Together, with every other employee, we will benefit from our improved competitive position and the opportunities created by this growth.

So let’s look ahead; not through rose colored glasses, but with plain sight. Our future lies with Southwest Airlines. In order to facilitate a smooth transition, we must focus on building upon those common traits which unite us with our peers, and we must recognize that it is in our collective interest to work together to help our new company navigate through uncharted territory.

With that in mind, I commend you on your unyielding professionalism. Together, we will write the next chapter of our careers.

In unity,

Linden Hillman, Chairman
ATN Master Executive Council

Looks like they took their own"internal union policy" and voted on it much like when DOH is voted on here, and "USAPA's internal UNION POLICY"!

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

Now this is some great work.

http://youtu.be/hKJL9uJOsRY

If you call flying 27% of EAST flying, attrition, and not to mention harassing a poor jogger "GOOD WORK!"

 

[cactusboy53]

Yes you are, No NIC ever, no pay raise coming and not alot of attrition out your way, not much of a future for you and Jetz. It sure sucks to be a westie these days.

Ah the red-headed step child of LIES speaks again! Who's going to "jail" this week, Skippy? Hey what do you call 9 1/2 months of vacation? Some call it RD!

BTW: The Nic sits neatly on Doug's office desk, awaiting Judge Silver's specific instructions . I'm still getting pay raises yearly, our captains still get over $25K more a year than your worn down - beat down narrow body captains, we all get one more week paid vacation, we all get 100% scheduled DH, Mechanical, & cancellation, and our attrition that we have will consist of 95% Captains (vs your 60%).

Leonidas is the BEST money ever spent. The delay clock is winding down, and that's all you have won. You did lose over $10,000,000 of OUR money on a DOH paper chase. I hear that Cleary & Bradford's pictures are going next to the Merriam Webster definition of "pariah". Nice work. Not much of a win, IMHO. Have a great day, I know I will.

 

[nevergiveup]

Ah the red-headed step child of LIES speaks again! Who's going to "jail" this week, Skippy? Hey what do you call 9 1/2 months of vacation? Some call it RD!

BTW: The Nic sits neatly on Doug's office desk, awaiting Judge Silver's specific instructions . I'm still getting pay raises yearly, our captains still get over $25K more a year than your worn down - beat down narrow body captains, we all get one more week paid vacation, we all get 100% scheduled DH, Mechanical, & cancellation, and our attrition that we have will consist of 95% Captains (vs your 60%).

Leonidas is the BEST money ever spent. The delay clock is winding down, and that's all you have won. You did lose over $10,000,000 of OUR money on a DOH paper chase. I hear that Cleary & Bradford's pictures are going next to the Merriam Webster definition of "pariah". Nice work. Not much of a win, IMHO. Have a great day, I know I will.

Try Xanax, might help.

 

[USA320Pilot]

deleted

 

[cactusboy53]

Try Xanax, might help.

Never;
I don't quite understand why I would need Xanax. I don't take any prescription medication. All I know is that Xanax is some sort of anti-anxiety medication. Here's the actual information:

Alprazolam (Xanax) is used to treat anxiety disorders and panic disorder (sudden, unexpected attacks of extreme fear and worry about these attacks). Alprazolam is in a class of medications called benzodiazepines. It works by decreasing abnormal excitement in the brain.

I don't have any sudden or unexpected attacks of extreme fear or worry of of such attacks. I am a normal well balanced American male. I have a great family & family life. I still enjoy & fly little airplanes as often as I can. I eat lots of fiber and exercise, and I support Leonidas the the greatest financial ability that I can.

Speaking of anxiety, panic & fear....do you suppose luvthe9, Claxon/Sumadarson/Nostrodomus/Apollo, & MM might need to seek this kind of medication? Some of the recent posts from these gentlemen have reeked of desperation.

 

[prechilill]

Try Xanax, might help.

A man of experience, we know...

 

[Iclubbabyseals]

I am a normal well balanced American male. I have a great family & family life.

When a teen, I used to do volunteer work at the local hospitals. At those clinics housing, um, mentally off people, it would surprise you (maybe not) how many said exactly the same thing. From their padded cell.

It would be a rare, culturally unaware and likely mentally deficient person who might venture self-diagnosis like that. I am cautious around people who beat their chests advertising how great they are.

So, you are still off the line? With full pay? Good for you.

 

[Captain Underpants]

Looks like yet another integration that doesn't use the "gold standard" of DOH. Another slotting using things like pay, career expectations, and the particular facts of their merger. Go figure! 😉

Once again, each integration turns on its own facts as there is no one-size-fits-all approach to seniority integrations.

I guess the Airtran guys saw the writing on the wall and realized the benefit to them in pay and working conditions. Imagine that.

Jetz,

If 83+% of both SWA and AirTran approved the seniority integration by vote then obviously both groups think it is fair whatever integration method they decided to use. I am truly happy it seems to have worked out well for them. Over here a straight vote on Nic would probably have 95+% West approving and 95+% East rejecting and obviously a problem.

Your feelings were hurt back when US and UAL started discussing a potential integration. US wanted what amounts to current USAPA merger policy which is DOH balanced with conditions and restrictions and fences to fulfill both groups pre-merger career expectations. UAL pilots were proposing to take all the aircraft but only integrate 1500 out of 6000 US pilots. Our CEO told me directly that the UAL pilots were focused on reducing the number of US pilots that could work at UAL after a merger wanting to offer no seniority or jobs for most pre-merger US pilots. He said the UAL CEO also rejected that proposal completely. We are not buying your East is an evil group of people mantra.

Your problem now with your new merger partner is ALPA merger policy leans towards pre-merger relative position. That would staple a very large number of UAL pilots to the bottom and would flip the UAL pilots hired in the 90's behind CAL pilots hired in the 2000's. That would result in a severe loss of income and career expectations for UAL pilots and a corresponding net gain for CAL pilots. The McCaskill-Bond law now forces you to use ALPA merger policy and makes the results enforceable with no recourse no matter how screwed up the result. I have been through 4 mergers in my career and have seen first hand how greed, self-interest and deception can corrupt a weak seniority integration policy. I honestly hope all UAL and CAL pilots will be satisfied and will consider the integration fair whatever the integration method. Unfortunately it looks to me like UAL pilots careers are at risk of a severe and permanent setback.

underpants

 

[cleardirect]

Jetz,

If 83+% of both SWA and AirTran approved the seniority integration by vote then obviously both groups think it is fair whatever integration method they decided to use. I am truly happy it seems to have worked out well for them. Over here a straight vote on Nic would probably have 95+% West approving and 95+% East rejecting and obviously a problem.

Your feelings were hurt back when US and UAL started discussing a potential integration. US wanted what amounts to current USAPA merger policy which is DOH balanced with conditions and restrictions and fences to fulfill both groups pre-merger career expectations. UAL pilots were proposing to take all the aircraft but only integrate 1500 out of 6000 US pilots. Our CEO told me directly that the UAL pilots were focused on reducing the number of US pilots that could work at UAL after a merger wanting to offer no seniority or jobs for most pre-merger US pilots. He said the UAL CEO also rejected that proposal completely. We are not buying your East is an evil group of people mantra.

Your problem now with your new merger partner is ALPA merger policy leans towards pre-merger relative position. That would staple a very large number of UAL pilots to the bottom and would flip the UAL pilots hired in the 90's behind CAL pilots hired in the 2000's. That would result in a severe loss of income and career expectations for UAL pilots and a corresponding net gain for CAL pilots. The McCaskill-Bond law now forces you to use ALPA merger policy and makes the results enforceable with no recourse no matter how screwed up the result. I have been through 4 mergers in my career and have seen first hand how greed, self-interest and deception can corrupt a weak seniority integration policy. I honestly hope all UAL and CAL pilots will be satisfied and will consider the integration fair whatever the integration method. Unfortunately it looks to me like UAL pilots careers are at risk of a severe and permanent setback.

underpants

There are so many things wrong with this post it would take to long to correct. Really not worth wasting my time. Besides you east guys never let facts get in the way of a good falsehood.

 

[prechilill]

You see underware captain, it takes two reasonable sides to make something work, one side cannot do it all...
A point you conveniently, but not surprisingly nonetheless, seemed to have missed in your above post. Keep playing your "majority rules" card, it's gonna work for you someday... ummm, no.

 

[Move2CLT]

When a teen, I used to do volunteer work at the local hospitals. At those clinics housing, um, mentally off people, it would surprise you (maybe not) how many said exactly the same thing. From their padded cell.

It would be a rare, culturally unaware and likely mentally deficient person who might venture self-diagnosis like that. I am cautious around people who beat their chests advertising how great they are.

So, you are still off the line? With full pay? Good for you.

Would that be the same as the east's "I don't need this job because I have a highly successful business of my own" self-diagnosis?

 

[luvthe9]

Keep playing your "majority rules" card, it's gonna work for you

Isn't that how a democratic society is suppose to work?