US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Claxon]

aqua,

You are correct that the West pilots can't directly negotiate contract terms with the company because the RLA can only recognize USAPA as the bargaining agent for the entire pilot group.

The West pilots individually or in groups can always discuss with USAPA what contract terms or proposals they would like USAPA to present to the company. Both USAPA and the company will likely soon ask the court to strongly "encourage" the West to participate in mediated talks. Both USAPA and the company want mediated seniority negotiations between the West pilot class and USAPA to try to reach a mutually acceptable seniority settlement which would then jointly be presented to the court. If the court approved the settlement it would then be presented to the company by USAPA included in a contract proposal to be ratified and implemented.

Of course the West pilots don't have to show up or they can show up and insist on Nic which is the same thing as not showing up.

underpants

The western will do another charge into the Wye River, and emerge wet and with the same outcome. They are not very good at compromise, and your best course of action would be to never, ever get an agreement with them. Of course they will make that very possible. The longer their bottom pilots insist on an action that the senior western do not agree with, the more likely they are split away in a merger. That would be good for all involved.

 

[CallawayGolf]

You are one sick dude. The guys flying those widebodies were here while you were in grade school.
You can stay in your right seat foranother 20 years.

NICDOA
NPJB

I wasn't in grade school on September 27, 2005 which is the date LCC came into existence (i.e. the "here" you made reference to). I guess you are a self-identified member of the willfully ignorant group I mentioned. Of course you can prove me wrong by showing us all how the west pilots didn't drop in relative seniority status in the integrated list awarded by Nicolau compared to their pre-integration HP status.

 

[88 B.T.D.]

You guys got nothing to offer to get us off the Nicolau.

What about original DOH. Be it Eastern, TWA, United, Mohawk, Trump, ......... There may be some folks on your side that would be interested.

 

[aquagreen73s]

What about original DOH. Be it Eastern, TWA, United, Mohawk, Trump, ......... There may be some folks on your side that would be interested.

So the answer for the DFR is DFR squared, as in DFRs coming from the East AND the West?

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

And furthermore, they (USAPA) are the only ones who can resolve the central issue outside of a federal injunction. Every money pit legal proceeding and contract-delaying negotiation tactic would be wiped clean tomorrow if USAPA accepted the NIC today. The NY status quo case would be history; the PHX DJ case would be history; the NC TRO could be lifted by Management request (if they thought USAPA was negotiating in good faith); and the JCBA negotiations could proceed quickly even under the NMB oversight once this seniority log jam is resolved. USAPA could easily accomplish all of this and save millions in legal fees and working to get hundreds of millions in pay improvements by simply accepting the already foregone conclusion that the NIC is it. $eham may still want his pound of flesh from Cleary's backside, but that's for those two unscrupulous characters to work out among themselves.

Quite the dreamer, and the FLT ATT have none of these issues and a substandard offer on the table, DUI DOUG will never put enough money on the table for a NIC solution to be accepted by anyone on the EAST, DREAM ON! This word "CONTRACT" is just like the word scratch, no one knows where it comes from what it looks like or how or what shape it will come in, one thing is for sure, it will be a PHX downsize or closure!

 

[Res Judicata]

What about original DOH. Be it Eastern, TWA, United, Mohawk, Trump, ......... There may be some folks on your side that would be interested.

Idiotic, straw grasping idea #538. Keep em comin'

USAPA is the complete failure we've always told you it was going to be. Accept the nic or STFU. We're done talking outside a Federal Court. Sleep Well!

 

[Move2CLT]

aqua,

You are correct that the West pilots can't directly negotiate contract terms with the company because the RLA can only recognize USAPA as the bargaining agent for the entire pilot group.

The West pilots individually or in groups can always discuss with USAPA what contract terms or proposals they would like USAPA to present to the company. Both USAPA and the company will likely soon ask the court to strongly "encourage" the West to participate in mediated talks. Both USAPA and the company want mediated seniority negotiations between the West pilot class and USAPA to try to reach a mutually acceptable seniority settlement which would then jointly be presented to the court. If the court approved the settlement it would then be presented to the company by USAPA included in a contract proposal to be ratified and implemented.

Of course the West pilots don't have to show up or they can show up and insist on Nic which is the same thing as not showing up.

underpants

Only USAPA wants mediated talks, not the company. And the DJ is not a venue for mediation. It's for decisions.

Our law firm already has a response crafted to USAPAs request and it's a no.

If you easties think you're getting another shot at this youre naive.

Arbitration is over.

 

[Move2CLT]

Okay then. You don't like the Nic and we don't like the Nic. Lets sit down and devise a better mousetrap.

It doesn't matter what you don't like. It's done.

Look at how the easties are scrambling for a redo. LMAO.

The end is near and they know it.

 

[Move2CLT]

Well, no, I'm not.

This has been going on for a long time and quite frankly, there has to be a better way out of this besides suing each other's pants off.

Can't you guys and gals sit down....together...and hash out some kind of hybrid list that would be acceptable to all parties? I think you can and you should.

I know it's a long shot but you have nothing to lose by trying and everything to gain.

Just my opinion.....not trying to ruffle anymore feathers. 🙂

When you gamble and lose, do you work out something with the dealer to get your money back?

No? Wonder why?

Ask the east guys why they wouldn't move off DOH during formal negs. And then during mediation and arbitration.

18 months and about $1M produced nothing nothing so we went to Nic.

What makes you think we can do something now? And the only thing the west gets is jacked and a precedence that arbitrations mean nothing.

Use some common sense please.

 

[OTTER574]

Quite the dreamer, and the FLT ATT have none of these issues and a substandard offer on the table, DUI DOUG will never put enough money on the table for a NIC solution to be accepted by anyone on the EAST, DREAM ON! This word "CONTRACT" is just like the word scratch, no one knows where it comes from what it looks like or how or what shape it will come in, one thing is for sure, it will be a PHX downsize or closure!

Enjoy LOA93. Many east Angry f/o's will retire on this bankrupt contract...like they should. Because they and the corrupt usapa east pilots created this mess.

PHX may shrink some (Delta SLC) with a joint contract (TA) that implements the NIC . But not as much as your beloved/closed hubs PIT/BWI has!

OTTER

 

[Move2CLT]

IMO if you all could figure out how to do that & stop hating each other this place might go some where. Just my o2.

Tell them to honor their agreements.

 

[88 B.T.D.]

It doesn't matter what you don't like. It's done.

Look at how the easties are scrambling for a redo. LMAO.

The end is near and they know it.

That's the problem. The end is nowhere in sight. We will not have a contract (unless concessionary) for at least five - six more years by the time appeals and DFR are completed.

 

[Reed Richards]

It doesn't matter what you don't like. It's done.

Look at how the easties are scrambling for a redo. LMAO.

The end is near and they know it.

The "answer" from the West on this forum is crystal clear, and expected. I can only guess the Association needs something a little more official on record..as anonymous board postings don't carry a lot of water in the legal system.

RR

 

[Move2CLT]

Very entertaining board this morning.

USAPA is sinking like a rock and you easties are telling us how we need to talk and find middle ground.

And now this new fantasy of Silver and the company encouraging talks! LMAO.

Not happening. Ever.

Silver has no interest and your lawyers aren't going to ask her.

Negotiations ended years ago and you cemented Nic in place with USAPA. You guys stepped on your cranks AGAIN!!

No more talks. Nic is it.

 

[aquagreen73s]

That's the problem. The end is nowhere in sight. We will not have a contract (unless concessionary) for at least five - six more years by the time appeals and DFR are completed.

And your point is?