US Pilots Labor Discussion

[nic4us]

I hope for his sake that it's not too late to get that lump sum. If the money has to go through the bankruptcy court, there's no telling what will happen.



As noted several posts earlier, the TA is simply a contract. Contracts can be renegotiated at any time if all parties involved agree. Since the West MEC and the East MEC have been subsumed through the legal federal election of a new bargaining agent, the company and USAPA can change the TA at their collective will. Up to this point, it has not been something the company was inclined to do. AA going Chapter 11 changes the game considerably.

Busdriver gets it!!!!

Well, almost. Now ask yourself, why won't the company and usapa change the TA, and disregarg the Nic?

Answere, because usapa has a DFR toward the West, and without a seperate West entity, neither the company or usapa are shieled from the hybrid DFR that would immediately follow any change that would cause the slightest harm to the West.

 

[OTTER574]

I specifically remember Doug telling you in a Crew News " THIS IS FOR YOU TO DECIDE" Either way, here is something in light of the American Airlines Tragedy. One more triumph of management over their workers. This is for you UHaul.

[media]► 2:46► 2:46 www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0f78MDOUJw[/media]

I specifically remember doug parker writing you and every pilot here at lcc that the NIC was accepted by lcc and waiting a joint contract. Do you remember or need a copy bs? Judge Silver has one..surely you and your crack jack legal team has one too.

OTTER

 

[Phoenix]

As you have been told repeatedly, feel free to substiitute usapa where it says ALPA.

Now, usapa either presents the "usapa" seniority integration proposal, commonly know as the Nic, or you guys sit on LOA93.

In any future merger scenario, usapa presents the Nic as the only "accepted" system seniority list for LCC, or the West shuts down any integrations between merger partner pilot groups. Perhaps that would be just what a combined company's management would desire, but, I highly doubt it would be what a numerically superior merger partner's pilot group would desire.

What you and Otter continually dream about is called an injunction for USAPA to use the Nic. By affirmation from the SCOTUS, that does not exist. You now hope that Silver will give the Company an injunction to use the Nic, but you might benefit from reading the 9th one more time...

"Under the TA, the carriers agreed not to object to ALPA's seniority integration proposal."

Concerning the TA and the 9th recounting of it, shall we just substitute USAPA where is says ALPA, as you suggest? Perhaps Silver should issue an injunction that the company cannot contractually object to the union's proposal and, besides the fact that they have no duty to fairly represent pilots, they also have a contract (the TA) that requires them to accept the union's proposal, and thus any DFR does and always has remained soley upon the union.

 

[OTTER574]

What you and Otter continually dream about is called an injunction for USAPA to use the Nic. By affirmation from the SCOTUS, that does not exist. You now hope that Silver will give the Company an injunction to use the Nic, but you might benefit from reading the 9th one more time...

"Under the TA, the carriers agreed not to object to ALPA's seniority integration proposal."

Concerning the TA and the 9th recounting of it, shall we just substitute USAPA where is says ALPA, as you suggest? Perhaps Silver should issue an injunction that the company cannot contractually object to the union's proposal and, besides the fact that they have no duty to fairly represent pilots, they also have a contract (the TA) that requires them to accept the union's proposal, and thus any DFR does and always has remained soley upon the union.

I and every west pilot determines whether or not we're harmed by usapa's illegal proposal. Not you and definitely not usapa. Enjoy your day in court AGAIN as a defendant in front of a Federal Judge concerning contract law. (how many? lost count since your corrupt birth)

usapa lies are numerous and hard to quantify, but easily Federal Judges smells a corrupt usapa RAT.

OTTER

 

[fifidriver]

"Thank you" to all on the forum for the info and entertainment... Longtime Lurker...

 

[Phoenix]

I and every west pilot determines whether or not we're harmed by usapa's illegal proposal. Not you and definitely not usapa. Enjoy your day in court AGAIN as a defendant in front of a Federal Judge concerning contract law. (how many? lost count since your corrupt birth)

usapa lies are numerous and hard to quantify, but easily Federal Judges smells a corrupt usapa RAT.

OTTER

Total up your damages and send me a bill. Take it easy on me and take a Xanax before you pick up the calculator.

 

[OTTER574]

Total up your damages and send me a bill. Take it easy on me and take a Xanax before you pick up the calculator.

It's very easy to add up and the date is very clear...phx.

See you in court tomorrow. Again young man, brush up on the RLA and CONTRACT LAW. I know that lcc (bob siegel) and my legal team has.

ps..if you wear your uniform..please, at least get it pressed and cleaned...hats are optional.

OTTER

 

[Phoenix]

It's very easy to add up and the date is very clear...phx.

See you in court tomorrow. Again young man, brush up on the RLA and CONTRACT LAW. I know that lcc (bob siegel) and my legal team has.

ps..if you wear your uniform..please, at least get it pressed and cleaned...hats are optional.

OTTER

Oh yeah, the date... when you take your Xanax I'll let you borrow my calendar. Don't drink too much you might forget to send me the bill. I'm waiting.

 

[nic4us]

What you and Otter continually dream about is called an injunction for USAPA to use the Nic. By affirmation from the SCOTUS, that does not exist. You now hope that Silver will give the Company an injunction to use the Nic, but you might benefit from reading the 9th one more time...

"Under the TA, the carriers agreed not to object to ALPA's seniority integration proposal."

Concerning the TA and the 9th recounting of it, shall we just substitute USAPA where is says ALPA, as you suggest? Perhaps Silver should issue an injunction that the company cannot contractually object to the union's proposal and, besides the fact that they have no duty to fairly represent pilots, they also have a contract (the TA) that requires them to accept the union's proposal, and thus any DFR does and always has remained soley upon the union.

By all means please do!

Usapa inherited the Nic, when it sought to represent the two groups who arbitrated. Therefore, "usage's" seniority integration proposal is the Nic.

what usapa would like to do is disregard it's duty to the West pilots, and substitute a list of it's own making, on it's own terms.

The company will never open itself up to the damages usapa has incurred upon itself, so bargain away, just remember usage's proposal is the Nic, no injunction needed!

 

[Phoenix]

By all means please do!

Usapa inherited the Nic, when it sought to represent the two groups who arbitrated. Therefore, "usage's" seniority integration proposal is the Nic.

what usapa would like to do is disregard it's duty to the West pilots, and substitute a list of it's own making, on it's own terms.

The company will never open itself up to the damages usapa has incurred upon itself, so bargain away, just remember usage's proposal is the Nic, no injunction needed!

You already spent $2M to get an injunction and it failed. The only way for you to get back into court to address what you think might be damages is to get a ratified contract without Nic. Why are you stalling?

 

[Res Judicata]

You already spent $2M to get an injunction and it failed. The only way for you to get back into court to address what you think might be damages is to get a ratified contract without Nic. Why are you stalling?

Who's stalling? Your East only NAC has been at the helm for years with your East only Leadership. What's the problem? That 2 mil. Was spent to get a jury conviction...it's paying off in spades. Without it, USAPA wouldn't be, once again, dragged onto federal court kicking and screaming tomorrow. Addington ripeness and the DJ ripeness are two wholly different issues. Silver said the DJ was ripe a long time ago. I think it's pretty clear she smells a rat among USAPA and "Johnny come lately".

Your side took charge in 2007 when you walked away from the bargaining table. Five and a half years of nothing but failures, embarrassment, and lawsuits. There is no end in sight either. Once again, the blame is all on you, you, YOU.

 

[Phoenix]

Who's stalling? Your East only NAC has been at the helm for years with your East only Leadership. What's the problem? That 2 mil. Was spent to get a jury conviction...it's paying off in spades. Without it, USAPA wouldn't be, once again, dragged onto federal court kicking and screaming tomorrow. Addington ripeness and the DJ ripeness are two wholly different issues. Silver said the DJ was ripe a long time ago. I think it's pretty clear she smells a rat among USAPA and "Johnny come lately".

Your side took charge in 2007 when you walked away from the bargaining table. Five and a half years of nothing but failures, embarrassment, and lawsuits. There is no end in sight either. Once again, the blame is all on you, you, YOU.

Stalling to get back into court. Pay attention.

Get with Otter and Nic, have a Xanax party and send me my bill. Ps. The union has been at the bargain table the whole time and had no control over any predecessor that walked away. Be sure to send the predecessor an itemized bill also.

 

[HPearlyretiree]

It will be very interesting. Especially in light of what the 9th said after your WAKE DEBACLE. Judge Silver is well aware of that outcome. She is going to be made well aware the WEST CLASS is refusing to come off their bargaining position, even in the face of Cleary seeking compromise. Your risk! Pretty stupid to turn down talks with the likes of George Mitchell and Abner. Also in light of what happened to the poor American people. She has got to be aware of those career expectations.Wait till you see the other mediator. Good luck with that. I hope Eric shaves.

Is the Great Pumpkin going to rise tomorrow as well?

What part of "Binding" do you not get?

Greedy entitlement east, this has already cost you so much, stay blind...it suits you.

 

[nic4us]

You already spent $2M to get an injunction and it failed. The only way for you to get back into court to address what you think might be damages is to get a ratified contract without Nic. Why are you stalling?

Actually, we spent something like $12 million.

Being a typical usapian, you fail to recognize that the money usapa spent is also West money.

Don't worry it will be accounted for in the damages.

Oh, and guess what, we don't need a ratified contract to sue for DFR. That just pertains to why Addington was dismissed.

 

[Keroseneuser]

What ever happens tomorrow, it sounds like they need to issue Blood pressure cuffs at the door! People are already about to blow a vein! :blink: