US Pilots Labor Discussion

[crazystnic]

IMHO it verges on quite nearly criminal. Changing CBA's for the sole purpose of evading a final & binding seniority arbitration, persecution of 24 union members with RICO accusations, using all member dues to fill the courts with as much litigation humanly possilbe, countless attempts to outspend our legal defense, etc.

It didn't have to come to this. This was a concerted effort to harm the AWA pilot group at any and all costs. A small junior group of pilots took us all on a ride with a dead end. That is a crime.

aww cry me a river... give me a break.. we all had a part in this...It wasn't one side or the other..
we are all responsible...

 

[CallawayGolf]

Callaway, agree with you except for Attrition.
should of been factored into the equation...

NIC dropped the ball even the neutral thought so on this issue

Excellent. Glad to hear. Perhaps this will help on the attrition issue.

The east got the top 517 positions, will take 2 of every three attrition upgrades, and will get the preponderance of the wage improvements versus the west. That's not bad at all when you consider the east could have been stapled below the west if the arbitration panel really wanted to harm east careers. Conversely, the west lost relative seniority positions, will receive only a small bump in wages in any new contract, and will get 1 of every three attrition upgrades. There's enou quid pro quo to equal things out on both side which means the award is not only unassailable in terms of the law and the agreed upon process, it is also fair to both sides in terms of shared harm and shared benefits.

 

[BoeingBoy]

IT'S FLAWED.

breeze

You forgot "IMHO"...

Jim

 

[BoeingBoy]

I don't believe it was Glass who finally admitted that MDA was mainline.....it was another Exec.

Strike one

Regardless, as you know, things were spiriling out of control at that point. As hard as the pilots were trying to stick together, there was a lot of misinformation being put out, not only by USAir management, but by two factions at ALPA.

Strike two.

Bottom line was, regardless of what you wanted MDA to be, the legal definition, according to USAir management, was that MDA was, in fact, part of mainline, and NIC got it wrong on where he placed those guys in his award.

Unless you can cite a court ruling or a law, that's strike three. Everyone is entitled to an their own opinion, nobody is entitled to their own facts...

Jim

 

[BoeingBoy]

It had nothing to do with flow through agreements, etc. It has everything to do with MDA being operated by mainline pilots, on mainline owned aircraft, under a mainline certificate, and handled by mainline employess, not to mention being mainline ticket stock.

breeze

That "IMHO" keeps eluding you doesn't it...

BTW, mainline employees still handle some Express flights and all Express flights are on "mainline" ticket stock...you're getting desperate as those straws you're grasping float away...

Jim

 

[Move2CLT]

According to who.....you commander Koontz?

no political agenda there, eh?

breeze

According to reality boo boo.

You should try it sometime.

 

[prechilill]

Breeze= Jamie J

 

[high*flyer]

Always an excuse and never acceptance of fact or taking responsibility for being wrong. Seniority does not equal DOH. You wouldn't be so prone to using profanity and hurling insults if you could just accept the simple fact that 17 years didn't earn you anything morales than six months earned an West pilot. Two different companies and two different DOHs to hold the exact same status.

What's Mesa got to do with anything and why do you suppose I have any relationship - past, present or future - with that organization?

 

[Move2CLT]

That "IMHO" keeps eluding you doesn't it...

BTW, mainline employees still handle some Express flights and all Express flights are on "mainline" ticket stock...you're getting desperate as those straws you're grasping float away...

Jim

Ouch! Well played Jim.

I can now hear breeze's wishful thinking from here!

 

[Move2CLT]

I stand behind my statement.
breeze

Umm ya.

That doesn't mean much.

 

[nic4us]

IMHO it verges on quite nearly criminal. Changing CBA's for the sole purpose of evading a final & binding seniority arbitration, persecution of 24 union members with RICO accusations, using all member dues to fill the courts with as much litigation humanly possilbe, countless attempts to outspend our legal defense, etc.

It didn't have to come to this. This was a concerted effort to harm the AWA pilot group at any and all costs. A small junior group of pilots took us all on a ride with a dead end. That is a crime.

No cactusboy, it was not a small group.

The West needs to understand that it was something to the tune of 2500 of these scabs that stripped us of union representation in an attempt to steal our jobs.

It was not a small group. It was basically the entire east list minus 500 pilots.

Further, they have committed both criminal and tortious acts. Everything from kicking West members out of open union meetings, to using ALPA info and resources to form their scab union, to assault in the union HQ, to lost laptops.

 

[cactusboy53]

aww cry me a river... give me a break.. we all had a part in this...It wasn't one side or the other..
we are all responsible...

Since I'm a little slow, why don't you spell out for us how the AWA pilot group is in any way responsible by our actions (vs. Defensive reactions) for where we are....

 

[nic4us]

Callaway, agree with you except for Attrition.
should of been factored into the equation...

NIC dropped the ball even the neutral thought so on this issue

No, the neutral though that the furloughees that had already returned post merger should have been given "some consideration".

Nic acknowledged the opinion and pointed out that it only bolstered the West position, that the east had far more to gain. In this particular topic, furloughees had already returned to work, way way way way ahead of when they would have absent a merger on just attrition that would have likely been gone anyway.

 

[Harry Callahan]

I've got a while.

Fair enough. My offer for coffee still holds if you're ever around Clt long enough. With that said I wish both East & West pilots the best. I'll stay out of your business here & most likely off this board as quite frankly it's toxic & I've better things to do.

 

[Freighterguynow]

Pass. I'll keep what I've got now.