US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Move2CLT]

Perhaps, but hasn't anyone learned not to count their chickens before they are hatched?

DOH, LOA93 snapbacks, parity, etc.

I guess not.

 

[CallawayGolf]

You win.

And you could win too if you accepted that:

1. East pilots are better off after the merger than they were before (odds of stand-alone survival were poor)

2. There is no avoiding the NIC, so accepting and moving on is preferable to stagnation

3. The NIC isn't as bad as USAPA propaganda makes it out to be or perhaps its actually not bad at all. Relative position enhancements generally favor the east vs. the west.

4. Wage improvements will only come be closing out S22 with the NIC.

5. Perhaps most importantly, you will feel so much better about yourself and your personal integrity knowing that you honored your agreements even if doing so wasn't your first choice. People rarely regret not making more money as they approach they end of their lives, but they do regret the harmful choices they have made which caused injury to someone else.

 

[nevergiveup]

DOH, LOA93 snapbacks, parity, etc.

I guess not.

Some people couldn't read between the lines if they were hi-lighted!

 

[cleardirect]

When did USAPA refuse to accept the arbitration, has a CBA been signed? We are all still at square one. The west sent this whole thing to the courts by prematurely suing USAPA. You should have gotten a contract, then sued had USAPA enforced DOH. A lot of money was wasted. I'm sure the lawyers are quite happy. Lesson learned?

Have the MDA guys used the Nicolau list yet? They prematurely sued ALPA. But the lawyers are quite happy. a lot of time and money wasted.

But you east guys never learn any lessons.

 

[Phoenix]

You win.

Don't bother telling him the sky is blue, because it isn't.

 

[CallawayGolf]

Some people couldn't read between the lines if they were hi-lighted!

Reading between the lines is over-rated. Did Wake read between the lines of the TA? Did Conrad read between the lines of the status quo requirements in the RLA? Did Kasher read between the lines of the LOA93 agreement? Do you think Silver is going to read between the lines of the TA and the RLA?

 

[767one]

And you could win too if you accepted that:

1. East pilots are better off after the merger than they were before (odds of stand-alone survival were poor)

2. There is no avoiding the NIC, so accepting and moving on is preferable to stagnation

3. The NIC isn't as bad as USAPA propaganda makes it out to be or perhaps its actually not bad at all. Relative position enhancements generally favor the east vs. the west.

4. Wage improvements will only come be closing out S22 with the NIC.

5. Perhaps most importantly, you will feel so much better about yourself and your personal integrity knowing that you honored your agreements even if doing so wasn't your first choice. People rarely regret not making more money as they approach they end of their lives, but they do regret the harmful choices they have made which caused injury to someone else.

#5. I don't regret the money I have lost other than the pension that alpa gave away (and I have recouped that on my own). I also have no regrets about my choices other than the fact that I once believed in alpa and what some of my alpa reps preached.

 

[767one]

No cactusboy, it was not a small group.

The West needs to understand that it was something to the tune of 2500 of these scabs that stripped us of union representation in an attempt to steal our jobs.

It was not a small group. It was basically the entire east list minus 500 pilots.

Further, they have committed both criminal and tortious acts. Everything from kicking West members out of open union meetings, to using ALPA info and resources to form their scab union, to assault in the union HQ, to lost laptops.
[/quote

I guess everyone in the world is a scab if they don't agree with you.

 

[Move2CLT]

#5. I don't regret the money I have lost other than the pension that alpa gave away (and I have recouped that on my own). I also have no regrets about my choices other than the fact that I once believed in alpa and what some of my alpa reps preached.

ALPA did not give your pension away. You did that yourself.

 

[crazystnic]

And you could win too if you accepted that:

1. East pilots are better off after the merger than they were before (odds of stand-alone survival were poor)

2. There is no avoiding the NIC, so accepting and moving on is preferable to stagnation

3. The NIC isn't as bad as USAPA propaganda makes it out to be or perhaps its actually not bad at all. Relative position enhancements generally favor the east vs. the west.

4. Wage improvements will only come be closing out S22 with the NIC.

5. Perhaps most importantly, you will feel so much better about yourself and your personal integrity knowing that you honored your agreements even if doing so wasn't your first choice. People rarely regret not making more money as they approach they end of their lives, but they do regret the harmful choices they have made which caused injury to someone else.

It really is funny watching you guys try to convince us to bend over.

You are doing what you think is right and we are doing the same

 

[fodase]

I guess everyone in the world is a scab if they don't agree with you.

Just people who blatantly steal to advantage themselves, people like you Bob.

 

[Move2CLT]

It really is funny watching you guys try to convince us to bend over.

You are doing what you think is right and we are doing the same

It's just that the courts have backed us up the entire way.

 

[Move2CLT]

From an eastie:

I've posted about this in another thread, but I believe the outcome of the DJA is a foregone conclusion.  From my prior work experience outside the airline industry, I am very familiar with legal documents and arguments.  I have learned from experience how to recognize when an attorney is pressing an argument they know is a loser in service to their client.  (Take a look at some death row appeals sometime - lengthy, well-written, but usually full of more holes than my kitchen colander!)  USAPA's arguments in the documents before Judge Silver carry this same air of defeat.  I feel quite certain that, privately, USAPA's legal team has informed the BPR that their odds of prevailing before Judge Silver are infinitesimally small.  I do not expect that the BPR would share that information with the rest of the pilot group, preferring instead to cast blame elsewhere if/when they are defeated in court in Phoenix.

I strongly suspect that, when Judge Silver hands down her decision, not only will the unaltered Nicolau award be ordered by the court to be part of any CBA agreed upon by USAPA and US Airways, but the ruling and its legal supporting arguments will be strong enough that the USAPA legal team will recommend strongly to their clients AGAINST an appeal to the Ninth.  Then, however the runoff turns out, we will see who among the USAPA officer corps and BPR wishes to face reality and move forward, and who wishes to continue on their cash-burning Quixotic quest while my family (and the families of 5000 of my fellow US Airways pilots) suffer along the way earning far less money - and enjoying far lesser work rules and benefits - than we should.

 

[fatherabraham]

From an eastie: blah blah blah............
- and enjoying far lesser work rules and benefits - than we should.

Boo Boo,
The remaining majority of Easties took it in the shorts for most of AAA tenure from the " I've got mine, screw you " types above.
It must really SUCK to be the minority for 1st time in their careers. I feel sooo bad for him

FA

 

[Pi brat]

Just people who blatantly steal to advantage themselves, people like you Bob.

Bob has to retire in less than a year. How exactly does any of this benefit him?