US Pilots Labor Discussion

[cleardirect]

You cast pearls in this pig pen? Tell us more about our sins. You almost have us persuaded.

No one agreed to any windfall. And in case you missed it, ALPA provided a means to reject a windfall (even if they shirked their responsability to follow their own policy). The pilots retained the authority to reject a windfall in a vote... You like the windfall, you deny the windfall, too bad majority decides what is a windfall.

Windfall is your opinion. The people responsible for the policy did not think it is a windfall. The arbitrator did not think it is a windfall. The courts do not think it is a windfall. Your "majority" is a minority when view outside your tiny group.

Please quote the part of ALPA merger policy that says there is a process for rejecting a perceived windfall. Just because Prater made up some BS meeting to appease an angry group does make it policy.

BTW you have the ability to reject the contract not the seniority list. So technically it would be the west rejecting the windfall of 90% of the contract going to the east.

 

[Move2CLT]

Supernatural......no, but arrogance comes to mind.

Said the entitled eastie.

 

[A320 Driver]

The courts do not think it is a windfall.

When was the fairness of the NIC tried in court? I must have missed that.

Driver...

 

[Move2CLT]

When was the fairness of the NIC tried in court? I must have missed that.

Driver...

Yes it was and it was found to be irrelevant.

What is your definition of fair? DOH?

The arbitrator and pilot neutrals found it to be fair as well as the company and ALPA.

Only the easties have a problem with it because its not DOH.

 

[Phoenix]

Windfall is your opinion.

Don't worry. A couple votes seem to indicate that it's the majority opinion.

 

[Phoenix]

Here's a few thoughts:

Hypocrisy is not against the law! Thank God for that as we'd have a lot of folks in prison.

Acting in ones own self interest is also not illegal.

Contracts are made to be broken

Lawyers get rich pitting ego against ego

Name calling is almost never productive,

Calling each other "Scabs" makes you look like petulant children

Carful. Careful. My West contacts asked me to warn you that they are on the verge of calling you a scab for failure to capitulate to their minority positions.

 

[Move2CLT]

Carful. Careful. My West contacts asked me to warn you that they are on the verge of calling you a scab for failure to capitulate to their minority positions.

I can understand why the both of you are giving each other bro-hugs since the both of you equally don't understand what you're talking about.

Tell me SH, if I steal your wallet so that I can have a bite to eat, am I not acting in my own self interest?

And PHX, once again, the courts have stated time and time again that the majority cannot harm the minority. With your logic, women would never have been able to vote and the civil rights movement would never have happened, right?

Hello? Sparrowhawk? PHX?

 

[cleardirect]

When was the fairness of the NIC tried in court? I must have missed that.

Driver...

There you go. The courts don't try fairness of an arbitration. Why is it that usapa keeps arguing fairness in court? Beginning to see the failure in usapa's plan?

Courts take as fact that arbitrations are fair. From the Frontier law suit.

The Plaintiffs are asking this court to review the merits of the seniority integration devised by the Arbitrator, and the court has no authority to do so under the Railway Labor Act or the McCaskill-Bond Amendment.

So in the eyes of the court there is no windfall with the Nicolau.

 

[A320 Driver]

There you go. The courts don't try fairness of an arbitration. Why is it that usapa keeps arguing fairness in court? Beginning to see the failure in usapa's plan?

Courts take as fact that arbitrations are fair. From the Frontier law suit.



So in the eyes of the court there is no windfall with the Nicolau.

IMO, you're playing a little fast and loose with your interpretations. You may be right that courts don't try fairness, but that's a far cry from your statement about the courts not seeing a windfall. Fact is, they haven't looked for one.

Driver...

 

[Res Judicata]

IMO, you're playing a little fast and loose with your interpretations. You may be right that courts don't try fairness, but that's a far cry from your statement about the courts not seeing a windfall. Fact is, they haven't looked for one.

Driver...

and they NEVER will.

 

[BoeingBoy]

You may be right that courts don't try fairness, but that's a far cry from your statement about the courts not seeing a windfall. Fact is, they haven't looked for one.

Actually, the courts do try fairness - what is a Duty of Fair Representation case about if not fairness?

The east, in it's smug certainty that it could do what it wanted merely because it was the majority, completely botched having a court judge the fairness of the Nic (not that the outcome would have changed). USAPA should have replaced the east MEC in the suit over the Nic but in it's arrogance didn't. So now you have lost the option of having a court look at the fairness of the Nic.

So now, having botched everything so far, you want to cry about fairness?

Jim

 

[cleardirect]

IMO, you're playing a little fast and loose with your interpretations. You may be right that courts don't try fairness, but that's a far cry from your statement about the courts not seeing a windfall. Fact is, they haven't looked for one.

Driver...

My original point was that east pilots are the only ones that see the Nicolau as a windfall. In the small sample of US Airways pilot it is the majority. In the larger sample of the rest of the world you are a very tiny minority that have the opinion the Nicolau is a windfall.

But by all means you and usapa keep going to down that path of windfall and fairness with the courts. They can't look at it and they won't look at it. It makes out job so much easier. Got any other arguments other than "it's not fair to east pilots"?

 

[Move2CLT]

Here's a few thoughts:

Hypocrisy is not against the law! Thank God for that as we'd have a lot of folks in prison.

Acting in ones own self interest is also not illegal.

Contracts are made to be broken

Lawyers get rich pitting ego against ego

Name calling is almost never productive,

Calling each other "Scabs" makes you look like petulant children

So SH, if your renter walked away from his lease in his self interest, you'd be OK with that? You wouldn't sue him because contracts are made to be broken?

I'd appreciate you actually think before you post here. I know you desperately want to interject thoughts regardless of whether or not they're relevant, or even logical, but come on.

 

[Move2CLT]

IMO, you're playing a little fast and loose with your interpretations. You may be right that courts don't try fairness, but that's a far cry from your statement about the courts not seeing a windfall. Fact is, they haven't looked for one.

Driver...

That's because there isn't a windfall.

The only perception of windfall lies in your little minds. Outside of that, no one sees it that way.

 

[Move2CLT]

Be curious how in control Ciabattoni is. If Music gets elected, which is doubtful as he's just as crazy as Javurek, it'll set the recall up for failure.

One thing about Ciabattoni, he know how to bide his time. With Jamie winning the election and a successful recall, attempt against Spike and his sidekick, any trace of Cleary's filth will be wiped away.

Reality TV ain't got nothin' on USAPA.