US Pilot Labor Thread--ALL Pilot/Union Issues Discussed Here

[V1cut]

I am becoming confused. Are we discussing USAPA or the Gestapo?

The retributive threats and snide warnings come right out of the G toolbox.

I think I will not be joining.
As far as the "we can fine you if you step out of line" crap coming out of the outraged FO club, good luck with that.

Assessments are one thing, administrative policy fines quite another.

this is getting easier as we speak.

Bye, then.

next?

Note:

Ableoneable: a NO vote.

?

 

[Tiger 1050]

Look everybody! V1cut. Another easty all jacked up on internet bravado! Kinda like another we all know and love. Come to think of it where is MachTuck these days? Hmmm. No Mach and suddenly Mr V1 magically shows up... Interesting.

 

[BoeingBoy]

Our dear friend Jim is wrong...(he's having another ALPA episode)...USAPA will not stand idly by while you blast away at them as a "generic" union member.

Since "generic" members aren't subject to the union's code of ethics, there's not much left to prosecute "blasting away" with. Unless you're counting on the ambiguous "consider the consequences of their actions upon the lives and careers of their fellow union pilots and our profession" language.

Jim

 

[UtterlyUdder]

Ya know, I was all set to explain my "cult" comment because you're one of the few that can engage in an adult discussion without resorting to slurs and name calling. Then I read the 2nd post after yours and figured that it illustrated my point nicely.

Jim

🙄 Slurs? Name callaing? Did you not understand Pi's post Sir? Not everyone on this forum genuflects to Boeing Boy, yanno? If you engage in "cult" comments, from what cult are you posting these days? :unsure:

 

[Megasnoop]

How's that MDA suit going....it's at the NMB, right???

Just to point out the difference between MDA Vs ALPO and this AOL shot in the dark:

MDA pilots involved were union members in good standing at ALPO, DFRing over a contract violation by ALPO, when ALPO refused to enforce the contract.

West pilots thumb their noses at their best chance for a quick settlement of the furloughs: the 2 grievance disputes that go to arbitration in Dec and Jan. Even if usapa wins the arbitrations, the west crowd still trash us.

Biggest problem for the Westies is John McIlvenna filing grievances on the 2 issues that their now suing over, putting both under NMB "minor disputes." McIllenna screwed the west guys into the wall and they wont admit it or dont even realize it. snooper


July 30, 2008

NOTICE OF GRIEVANCE -VIA EMAIL/CERTIFIED MAIL, RR REQUESTED

Captain Ken Wood
Chief Pilot – West

Steve Bradford
Interim President

RE: Grievance – Company Duty to Apply Current West Vacancy Bid under Operational
Pilot Integration as outlined in the Transition Agreement

Dear Sirs:

I am filing a grievance in accordance with the provisions of the America West Airlines/ALPA Collective Bargaining Agreement. Specifically, I am grieving that US Airway’s recent issue of a West-only displacement bid is in violation of the AWA/ALPA agreement as amended by the Transition Agreement.

I became aware of this grievance on or about July 25, 2008, when I received a copy of the
West displacement bid that proposes a downgrade of 138 West Captains, and furloughs of 175 West First Officers. As a result of this bid, I will be forcibly downgraded to First
Officer while East pilots that are junior to me on the merged seniority list continue to hold their higher-paying Captain positions.




Captain Ken Wood
Chief Pilot – West

Steve Bradford
Interim President

RE: Grievance under Section 29 of the AWA/ALPA CBA

Dear Sirs:

I am filing a grievance in accordance with the provisions of the America West Airlines/ALPA Collective Bargaining Agreement. Specifically, I am grieving that the
Section 29 – Union Shop Fees/Agency Shop portion of the agreement was automatically transferred to the new collective bargaining agent (USAPA) without completion of a newly bargained amendment to the existing CBA between USAPA and US Airways to specifically transfer and apply the provisions of the AWA/ALPA CBA Section 29 to USAPA. The “Associationâ€￾ in Section 29 is clearly...

Sincerely,

John McIlvenna
AWA Employee No. P2203
US Airways Employee No. 272974

 

[BoeingBoy]

Megasnoop,

You are correct - there are differences in the specifics of the suits. However, I was replying to V1Cut's theory that "After all, the NMB has jurisdiction over all NMB sanctioned unions and their "litigation"...no?"

In that one respect V1Cut was wrong - a suit against the union certified by the NMB can be brought in the judicial arena by members or non-members. V1Cut admitted as much (for which I salute him/her).

Jim

 

[EastUS]

As a result of this bid, I will be forcibly downgraded to First
Officer while East pilots that are junior to me on the merged seniority list continue to hold their higher-paying Captain positions.


John McIlvenna

OK..This is just "too good" for words = Mr "All Out Warfare" himself is now a member of the "Angry First Officers' Club" out west? Umm..and of course: ...... while East pilots that are junior to me on the merged seniority list continue to hold their higher-paying Captain positions. Translation, as already well established within westie protocol from no less than Leonidas = "I want the captain seat..and most of all, I want every single east pilot to pay for it".

Ho-Boy!..Folks..You truly just can NOT make this type of BS up I now must revisit some personal notions on eastern religious beliefs...It truly seems there may well be such a thing as karma....

 

[BoeingBoy]

Oh - almost forgot....

Filing a grievance does not automatically make a dispute "minor" although that is probably one of the first decisions the judge will have to make with respect to the furlough out of seniority issue (and personally I think odds favor a ruling that that one issue is a minor dispute).

It's the DFR issues that don't fall under either "minor" or "major" disputes (since those categories are for disputes over the contract) that I suspect will be the meat of the case. Nobody knows how that will turn out.

Jim

 

[nostradamus]

"Happy is the hearing man; unhappy the speaking man."

Ralph Waldo Emerson

 

[ableoneable]

"Happy is the hearing man; unhappy the speaking man."

Ralph Waldo Emerson

"I hate quotes"

- Walt Whitman -

 

[Megasnoop]

Westies at it again (from the latest usapa update about the PHX members meeting):

"There is one other issue that we would like to report to the Pilots concerning the meeting. Just prior to the meeting, a group of approximately 18 former AWA non-union member Pilots were present and requested to stay at the meeting. USAPA had made it very clear on the meeting invitations that the meeting was only open to members in good standing -- those who pay dues as active Union members. When asked to leave, they drew cameras to shoot pictures of both USAPA Officials and those who remained seated; it was obvious that a planned camera shoot was taking place. After a short display of frustration, non-members vacated the room and when only union members remained, the meeting convened. USAPA wants to make it perfectly clear that the Union wants Pilot participation and dialog, but Union meetings have and always will be reserved for members in good standing. In fact, the overlying theme of the entire meeting was participation and representation. All the speakers welcomed former AWA Pilots to assume leadership positions in the Union when they can do so without fear of reprisals from their fellow Pilots, so that all points of view can be heard and debated. All the speakers stressed that dialog and Union participation are part of the solution."

 

[Furlough Fodder]

Westies at it again (from the latest usapa update about the PHX members meeting):

"There is one other issue that we would like to report to the Pilots concerning the meeting. Just prior to the meeting, a group of approximately 18 former AWA non-union member Pilots were present and requested to stay at the meeting. USAPA had made it very clear on the meeting invitations that the meeting was only open to members in good standing -- those who pay dues as active Union members. When asked to leave, they drew cameras to shoot pictures of both USAPA Officials and those who remained seated; it was obvious that a planned camera shoot was taking place. After a short display of frustration, non-members vacated the room and when only union members remained, the meeting convened. USAPA wants to make it perfectly clear that the Union wants Pilot participation and dialog, but Union meetings have and always will be reserved for members in good standing. In fact, the overlying theme of the entire meeting was participation and representation. All the speakers welcomed former AWA Pilots to assume leadership positions in the Union when they can do so without fear of reprisals from their fellow Pilots, so that all points of view can be heard and debated. All the speakers stressed that dialog and Union participation are part of the solution."

One of the group 18 that was there and proud of it.

BTW not only a former "AWA non-union member Pilot" but also a former pilot of the new US Airways also.

 

[NiceLandingCaptain]

I love this part:

When asked to leave, they drew cameras to shoot pictures of both USAPA Officials and those who remained seated; it was obvious that a planned camera shoot was taking place.

But actually the author meant to say:

When asked to leave, they drew cameras to shoot pictures of both USAPA Officials and those who remained seated; once the entire usapa leadership contingent recovered from their hiding places behind the podium, it was obvious that a planned camera shoot was taking place.

Pretty scary stuff, those union meetings. It was a wise move for armed rent-a-cops to be present, dutifully guarding the exalted one and his faithful minions.

 

[hp_fa]

It was a wise move for armed rent-a-cops to be present, dutifully guarding the exalted one and his faithful minions.

Your kidding, right? Armed security was present?

 

[ableoneable]

No, not kidding.

The rental cops also escorted the exalted to and from their vehicles. Apparently USAPA's leadership is very jumpy and they see monsters in the shadows.

If USAir remains in business I expect to be working under the current CBA for a very, very long time.