AFA labor discussion (Work related)

[VAflyGal]

I know. Let's play a game. It's called "What's great about our new contract."
One, two, three, post!

 

[valuesrok]

Instead of the previous "seniority is back for reserves," it's now " a more seniority based way that will allow reserves to earn a living..." Who didn't see that very kind of equivocation coming? I'm sure that even the least sentient among us who attempted to understand the convoluted hooey that was circulated as the "Reserve TA" immediately spotted the red flag, a tidbit of information that would hopefully be lost in the sh** cloud hovering over the text: that is, that forcing a reserve to work a four-day trip if the grouping is "closed" and the reserve is good for four days, is a blatant affront to seniority-driven trip awards. More aptly stated, seniority is back...kind of, sometimes.

UMMMMM. FORCING, FORCING?! Just who do you propose should work a 4 day trip????? The senior reserve with 4 days available or the junior reserve with 2 days available? My biggest fear about this TA, if it gets passed, is that scheduling will misjudge the amount of reserves for closed/open groupings resulting in junior flight attendants being FORCED to give up golden days in order to staff trips. Think about it, it's a very real possibility. I'm not down with the open/closed AT ALL. We need to be prepared to fly what we are good for or it will be on the backs on our fellow F/A's who have BID their schedules only to have them taken away because Heaven forbid some senior reserve doesn't want to work when they are scheduled.

I surely hope I have misunderstood you. I am beyod fuming right now.

 

[MAAMARCH04]

UMMMMM. FORCING, FORCING?! Just who do you propose should work a 4 day trip????? The senior reserve with 4 days available or the junior reserve with 2 days available? My biggest fear about this TA, if it gets passed, is that scheduling will misjudge the amount of reserves for closed/open groupings resulting in junior flight attendants being FORCED to give up golden days in order to staff trips. Think about it, it's a very real possibility. I'm not down with the open/closed AT ALL. We need to be prepared to fly what we are good for or it will be on the backs on our fellow F/A's who have BID their schedules only to have them taken away because Heaven forbid some senior reserve doesn't want to work when they are scheduled.

I surely hope I have misunderstood you. I am beyod fuming right now.

UMMMMM, I'm an 11 year Reserve F/A (junior) and in the last 3+ years I have NEVER been assigned into my off days....NEVER! This whole premise that this new Reserve T/A is predicated upon, "Reserves don't want to be forced to fly into their OFF days", is a false premise....a lie. Now it may happen once in awhile around the holidays, but it certainly is not something that happens with regularity.

The company wants this because they don't want to continue splitting trips.....THIS happens a lot and THIS costs them money.

I will vote NO on this contract because I do not want my choice of trips taken away from me. Being forced to take a 4-day domestic trip when a 3-day transatlantic is available WILL COST ME MONEY in the form of lost Transatlantic Pay, extra van tips, better per diem. MF cannot spin his way out of this fact!

 

[ggiby]

Really? You must not know of many people. We have a few f/a's that are lawyers. Yes lawyers. And accountants, I can think of a few with those qualifications that I would like see negotiating. I can name many, Michael E, Terry G, Paul F, Paul H George R, Lee H, Bryan O, and any RSV that is fed up and angry with this mess that has passion for the F/A group and is planning on having this career here for a long, long time.

I don't see them stepping up to the plate. That is what I meant w/ my original post. They are not beating the doors down..... when they do we can take a vote on them... Until then, Where are they?????

 

[Onestep2flt]

UMMMMM. FORCING, FORCING?! Just who do you propose should work a 4 day trip????? The senior reserve with 4 days available or the junior reserve with 2 days available? My biggest fear about this TA, if it gets passed, is that scheduling will misjudge the amount of reserves for closed/open groupings resulting in junior flight attendants being FORCED to give up golden days in order to staff trips. Think about it, it's a very real possibility. I'm not down with the open/closed AT ALL. We need to be prepared to fly what we are good for or it will be on the backs on our fellow F/A's who have BID their schedules only to have them taken away because Heaven forbid some senior reserve doesn't want to work when they are scheduled.

I surely hope I have misunderstood you. I am beyod fuming right now.

I think this is the point that is being made. They are selling you on the part that you are getting your seniority back. Good luck to you when your group is "closed" to pick up your trip in seniority order. The way I understand it is when you truly had seniority it all worked out because the more senior reserves got what they wanted early in the month and as they started timing out the the more junior reserves started to get what they wanted. My friend was very junior in the base they were at and had no problem timing out with that system. What they are trying to sell you now is the same thing as LTO with different words. I believe forcing is a correct term! If you have a true seniority system you have a choice in what you want to do.

There is always going to be a need for reserves. There is always going to have to be a time when that reserve won't be able to pick a trip through being quick called or what have you. However when there are trips available for the next day you should have your seniority intact.

Interesting think I just learned. The other thing they want is for you to have PBS. However, they don't wish to use it to its full advantage if there even is such a thing. Ask your leaders why the open time that is left over can't be placed in a reserve line. Another words you could potentially place one or two actual trips in your monthly bid. So, in essence you could have some days where you might actually not be on reserve during the month. I think that other airlines that use this system call them reliever lines. Does not matter what they are called. What is does is put a name on every open trip. In theory there should be no open time left on any given day. Of course there are cons to that. One is since there was no open time as a reserve there most likely would be no trips for you to choose for the next day. You would most likely only be called the night before if someone called in sick or what not. The good would be they could potentially be able to operate with only a few percent of strait reserves. As it stands now, from what I am told is that some months especially winter you guys might have up to 20 percent reserves. This does not seem to be in line with your peers at other carriers.

My question would be this. If after five years of telling you guys that PBS is so bad why is it now so good now? Also, if it is so good, Why are you not using it to its full capacity to offer reserves days with actual trips in them already assigned?

I can't confirm where the info originally came from, but the source I got it from usually is correct and does not share it if it is only rumor. I do think Caution is needed as well as further investigation. However, if true it is just one more thing that your leaders are not sharing with everyone.

 

[Zarah]

Terri took down the Philly LEC and was just caught in the taint of those in office. She sacraficed her AFA position doing what she thought was right for the FA Group. To my knowledge she is not seeking a position within AFA and until such time as she is then discussing her should be considered off topic.

 

[Travelpro72]

Why has Terry Never been elected to any office? Because the Majority did not want her in office..!!

Never been elected to office? She was the VP of Local 70. The ONLY reason she stepped down was to protect the membership. Terry's knowledge of the contract is infinite. Her ability to negotiate is lightyears beyond what we see in the JNC today. TERRY GRAF needs to be in the mix.

 

[Zarah]

If you pass, you can be assigned a trip or OPR later.

If you pass you can cause a group to be closed.

EVERY time you log into the Crew Tracking System, you will be required to check your daily and future schedule to verifiy any changes that have been made.

The only time you can use your seniority in this contract is when Crew Scheduling decides you can.

Just sayin.

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

Never been elected to office? She was the VP of Local 70. The ONLY reason she stepped down was to protect the membership. Terry's knowledge of the contract is infinite. Her ability to negotiate is lightyears beyond what we see in the JNC today. TERRY GRAF needs to be in the mix.

Just asking, Thanx in advance for any answers . How many of the 450? EXL's came back, and how many of the took the money for seniority, are left to recall before hiring off the street? Remember NO section of a CBA is CLOSED until it is ratified. Thanx MM!

 

[MyrnaMinkoff]

UMMMMM. FORCING, FORCING?! Just who do you propose should work a 4 day trip????? The senior reserve with 4 days available or the junior reserve with 2 days available? My biggest fear about this TA, if it gets passed, is that scheduling will misjudge the amount of reserves for closed/open groupings resulting in junior flight attendants being FORCED to give up golden days in order to staff trips. Think about it, it's a very real possibility. I'm not down with the open/closed AT ALL. We need to be prepared to fly what we are good for or it will be on the backs on our fellow F/A's who have BID their schedules only to have them taken away because Heaven forbid some senior reserve doesn't want to work when they are scheduled.

I surely hope I have misunderstood you. I am beyod fuming right now.

 

[Onestep2flt]

Terri took down the Philly LEC and was just caught in the taint of those in office. She sacraficed her AFA position doing what she thought was right for the FA Group. To my knowledge she is not seeking a position within AFA and until such time as she is then discussing her should be considered off topic.

Although I understand where your logic comes from, this person has been brought up here by several posters as potential replacement for any potential position that may become available. What is agreed is the current establishment must go. When someone is brought up as a potential replacement I think it only fair to discuss the good the bad and the ugly.

I certainly have no personal beef with this person as I have never met them. My one issue is with while said person was in office for better or worse the local union office was not available when needed for my friend. They ended up getting help no questions asked from Pittsburgh. The local Philly LEC was in meltdown and toward the end NOBODY was minding the shop. As I have said many, many times I am certain that Miss Graff is a good person with passion to TRY and make change for the better. That is confirmed by the number of posters on here that support her for such a position. She did have an uphill battle on her hands with what sounds like a MR. Floes like president that was self serving. It does sound like Miss Graff was trying to expose that as she should have. In the end she probably did do the right thing by stepping down. I applaud her in that fact. She may indeed be a useful voice now for trying to oust the current regime. In the end, if she wants to earn respect she will work from the outside for change and allow someone new take the helm. She may be a useful force to rally folks to take back your union, but do it from the outside.

I have said this before but is important to repeat. Part of the problem with your union is the same people keep regenerating over and over again. The only way to break this cycle is to find people with new ideas and new faces. Everybody talks about the EXPERIENCE of this person or that. Having held a union position before does not make anyone more experienced than any other flight attendant except maybe to be tainted by the politics. You have so many talented people in your ranks. Find people that have the drive, desire and are not part of the "ESTABLISHMENT OF EXPERIENCE" you have now. You need some new faces.

 

[NoMoreKoolAid]

Why has Terry Never been elected to any office? Because the Majority did not want her in office..!!

She was my LEC in LAX when I statrted. She brought Teamsters on the PSA property and has 38 years of union work under her belt. She runs circles around the other reps. Terry negotiated 2-3 contracts and even though you dislike her would run to your defense at 3am in the morning should you need it without blinking. Most of all she would never sell us out. They don't make union people like her anymore.

 

[NoMoreKoolAid]

When she was in office - she was asked to step down....and not all that long ago. Someone that was asked to step down? Really?

Nice lady but .....seriously bizarre posts. Can we please move forward?

Please get the facts on what actually took place before you post crap like that. It shows you have no concept of what happened. I was PHL based at the time and was in the room. She did what at the time she thought was right, no one asked her to do leave. More than I can say for the people we have now. I hope they would call her to go to the table for us, by some of these posts they don't deserve what she could deliver.

 

[Travelpro72]

Ya got that right! !

 

[Onestep2flt]

Please get the facts on what actually took place before you post crap like that. It shows you have no concept of what happened. I was PHL based at the time and was in the room. She did what at the time she thought was right, no one asked her to do leave. More than I can say for the people we have now. I hope they would call her to go to the table for us, by some of these posts they don't deserve what she could deliver.

I do not want to pick at you, we seem to be striving for the same things. I was not at the meeting that you speak of obviously. I did have a friend that was. You might be technically correct that nobody asked Miss Graff to leave. What did happen was that someone in attendance suggested that the whole LEC resign. In the end that is what happened. There was a lot of emotion from everyone in that room if my facts are clear. There was name calling, finger pointing, and as was the case for quite a while nothing productive was getting accomplished.

I know everyone that was there may have different viewpoints but in the end the right thing took place.