Nov/Dec 2013 Pilot Discussion

[EastUS1]

 
It's too bad not everyone can evade their prior agreements by forming a "union"
 
If I thought like an Usapian, if I don't like my house payment, I simply change my name
 

 
Do get back to us all immediately after rectifying the "If I thought" problem, should that happy day ever arrive.

 

[Pi brat]

 
It's too bad not everyone can evade their prior agreements by forming a "union"
 
If I thought like an Usapian, if I don't like my house payment, I simply change my name
 

The first agreement we had, the TA, made the forming of another union irrelevant to the separate ops issue.

 

[Pi brat]

"per the US Airways/USAPA MOU:

• Allow for a $40 million lump sum signing bonus to be equally distributed by USAPA to all eligible pilots as of the Effective Date. This represents approximately $10,000 per pilot.

I feel the plain meaning of the agreement in regards to the MOU between US Airways and USAPA was for each pilot, who was on the US Airways East or US Airways West seniority list on or before Feb 8, 2013, is that such pilot have an equal share of the upcoming $40 million lump sum signing bonus."
 
 
I wonder what he thinks the clear meaning of 10h in the MOU was?
 
Actually the author of the above is wrong. The lump sum wasn't in the MOU, it was in a side letter and here is what it said:
 
"1. If the Merger is approved by the Bankruptcy Court in In re AMR Corporation, et al., Case No. 11-15963 (SHL), and a merger involving US Airways and American is publicly announced, a lump sum payment of $40 million shall be earned and paid, on the effective date of the Plan of Reorganization as confirmed by the Bankruptcy Court (the "Effective Date"), by US Airways to pilots currently or previously represented by the US Airline Pilots Association (“USAPA,” or the “Association”).
The payment will be allocated to individual pilots according to a formula to be provided by USAPA, along with each pilot’s individual allocation. USAPA will provide the formula and the amount of each pilot’s allocation at least two (2) months prior to the date the payment is to be made.
The $40 million shall be the total amount paid, and no additional fringe benefits or other payments (e.g., DC retirement contributions) shall be made."
 
It was up to USAPA and they formed an ad hoc committee to study and come up with a proposal for how to allocate the money. One of the members was a westie.
 
I know none of that matters if it really, really just isn't fair.

 

[EastUS1]

Why all the confusion and shock?

 
Point taken. Nothing from self-styled "spartans" (over the age of at most 14) should serve to surprise at any level. 🙂
 
Seriously though; it seems you're flourishing pom poms for a tiny number of greedy fools who are seeking to prevent even your own group from timely receipt of their signing bonus, in favor of litigating for what exactly?...Perhaps a whopping $4-5k more for themselves?...And this not only "makes sense" to you, but is something you're pleased to see happening? Might you attempt some/ANY explanation of your thought process here?
 
Don't fret on my account, as if some grand coup's been accomplished. Given the pitiful sums involved; I couldn't personally care much less about the bonus, but why try to screw everyone, inclusive of your very own group? How do you see that as a good thing?
 
Again I must hope for their own sake that the APA's monitoring west antics here.

 

[Phoenix]

"per the US Airways/USAPA MOU:

• Allow for a $40 million lump sum signing bonus to be equally distributed by USAPA to all eligible pilots as of the Effective Date. This represents approximately $10,000 per pilot.

I feel the plain meaning of the agreement in regards to the MOU between US Airways and USAPA was for each pilot, who was on the US Airways East or US Airways West seniority list on or before Feb 8, 2013, is that such pilot have an equal share of the upcoming $40 million lump sum signing bonus."
 
 
I wonder what he thinks the clear meaning of 10h in the MOU was?
 
Actually the author of the above is wrong. The lump sum wasn't in the MOU, it was in a side letter and here is what it said:
 
"1. If the Merger is approved by the Bankruptcy Court in In re AMR Corporation, et al., Case No. 11-15963 (SHL), and a merger involving US Airways and American is publicly announced, a lump sum payment of $40 million shall be earned and paid, on the effective date of the Plan of Reorganization as confirmed by the Bankruptcy Court (the "Effective Date"), by US Airways to pilots currently or previously represented by the US Airline Pilots Association (USAPA, or the Association).The payment will be allocated to individual pilots according to a formula to be provided by USAPA, along with each pilots individual allocation. USAPA will provide the formula and the amount of each pilots allocation at least two (2) months prior to the date the payment is to be made.
The $40 million shall be the total amount paid, and no additional fringe benefits or other payments (e.g., DC retirement contributions) shall be made."
 
It was up to USAPA and they formed an ad hoc committee to study and come up with a proposal for how to allocate the money. One of the members was a westie.
 
I know none of that matters if it really, really just isn't fair.

Yeah, all that may be true but the Westies are asking for the matter be resolved without regard to a purely lawful basis, but instead based primarily on a consideration of the evidence.

 

[Phoenix]

It's too bad not everyone can evade their prior agreements by forming a "union"
 
If I thought like an Usapian, if I don't like my house payment, I simply change my name
 

Talk about evading agreements.... 98% "yes" means "no", when you are a Spartan, Dire Wolf, Scab Spotter, Clown Finder, Paragon of Integrity, or Goat Fetishist. 🙂

"10h, the big lie. Endorsed by Phoenix, yet rejected by 98% of West pilots. Duh"

 

[Phoenix]

Silver has a memory issue or a math issue. Her latest order granting USAPA an extension to 11 pages (from 7), but chides USAPA for needing an extra day to craft 1 additional page...

It was the plaintiff that couldn't follow orders, exceeded their filing by 5+ pages, and wanted the unfair advantage to be overlooked. Now Silver is chiding USAPA and can't even remember what she said.

 

[Reed Richards]

 
Wow!...Just plain WOW! Since when did west philosophy ever begin to at all suggest that furloughed folks held even the slightest value? So nowadays it's: "As you are surely aware, being placed on furlough is due to circumstances beyond a pilot's control and a pilot is placed on furlough through no fault of his own."...? Seriously? How very convenient indeed. 😉 .....And just what kind of hapless buffoons would engage lawyers over so paltry a sum in any case? Is there simply something in the very air/water/whatever out there that compulsively addicts people to the smell of courtrooms? Some of "you'se" people are nothing short of clinically INSANE!
 
I do sincerely hope folks from the APA are watching all this. It'd serve them well to learn the true nature of the west people they'll be stuck with ahead of time.

I read 4 of the West depos.  3 of the 4 stated flatly that a furlough pilot brings NOTHING to a merger, in fact they were all asked to clarify..and all 3 said they should go to the bottom of any list.  These depos were in September 2013.  And oh yeah, the 4th guy?  He was on furlough by choice, in fact dropped out of school on the East to go BACK to furlough. You cannot make this stuff up. What a bunch of selfish as....oles.  They were willing to throw the next guy sitting down for deposition under the bus.  I can guarentee they all could care less about these guys in question getting profit sharing.  Its all about "using" their situation to gum up the works. RR

 

[prechilill]

I read 4 of the West depos.  3 of the 4 stated flatly that a furlough pilot brings NOTHING to a merger, in fact they were all asked to clarify..and all 3 said they should go to the bottom of any list.  These depos were in September 2013.  And oh yeah, the 4th guy?  He was on furlough by choice, in fact dropped out of school on the East to go BACK to furlough. You cannot make this stuff up. What a bunch of selfish as....oles.  They were willing to throw the next guy sitting down for deposition under the bus.  I can guarentee they all could care less about these guys in question getting profit sharing.  Its all about "using" their situation to gum up the works. RR

 
It's fun watching Joe S come unglued...
How's that "Merger is dead" prediction working out for ya?  LOL

 

[prechilill]

 
Uh, I think these folks were furloughed incorrectly due to the evasive actions of some to avoid their agreements.
 
I.e., the arbitrated seniority list.
 
Why all the confusion and shock?

 Criminals have hard time accepting responsibility... it's how the roll in life.
 
Zebras never change their stripes either.

 

[Reed Richards]

 
It's fun watching Joe S come unglued...
How's that "Merger is dead" prediction working out for ya?  LOL

It is working out VERY well.  Best crow I have ever eaten. RR (aka Joe S.)

 

[Crzipilot]

Along those same lines,   shouldn't the new hires in class last month get their share of the 40mil?

 

[Phoenix]

Along those same lines,   shouldn't the new hires in class last month get their share of the 40mil?

Personally I think everyone on the seniority list, regardless of status, at the effective date, should receive equal portions. That said I also respect the deliberative and authoritative process that was legally followed, and I wouldn't waste anytime or money whining about it. Fair is fair.

 

[Crzipilot]

I mean if that's the case....then there should have been a larger sharing of some stock options a few years back..  
 
Did you hear us ####.?     Don't think so...
 
 
I think the loa 93 distributions too.   If you weren't on property or on leave,  you didn't get some of it.    

 

[Claxon]

alpa shills, from retirment and insurance committee no less, spreading fear amongst LTD East pilots to not vote for USAPA a few years ago.
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=axU9DnZKExw