US Pilot Labor Thread--ALL Pilot/Union Issues Discussed Here

[fodase]

On Tuesday, the self appointed USAPA leadership filled in a legal square and held a PHX local council meeting. About 30 west pilots traveled to downtown Phoenix to attend. Little did they know that the meeting was a legal proceeding, not a friendly gathering of airline pilots. Greeting the professional pilots were two uniformed police officers and USAPA attorney Lee Seham. The police presence was clearly an intimidation tactic by Mr. Bradford.

from usapawatch.com

Before the meeting began, a roster was checked to ensure that only members in good standing were in attendance. After cross checking the list, only two pilots were deemed to be in good standing and allowed to remain. Considering that no west pilots are in good standing per the USAPA CB&L’s, we find this absolutely amazing. Mr. Bradford should have expected better legal counsel from Mr. Seham and either allowed all to remain or to dismiss everyone and adjourn the meeting for a lack of member attendance.



As only two pilots were allowed to remain, we cannot report on the nature of the business conducted. As a coincidence, however, US Airways CEO Doug Parker held a Crew News on the same day. We confirmed exactly what we’ve been reporting. USAPA is eons away from a contract as their demands at the table are utterly outrageous.



Until the US Airways pilots realize that Mr. Bradford’s goals are unattainable, LOA 93 will be a reality for the east pilots.

 

[NiceLandingCaptain]

Perhaps it requires excessive mental agility to read and understand that the "union graft" was referencing Alpa's tenure...? 🙄

Quite possibly true. But the point of the letter is to indicate that usapa is maneuvering towards much the same behavior.

Does the association allow for an "open books" policy? According to Mark K., in a word, NO!

Do you trust these folks to be good trustees of your money?

 

[EastUS]

Until the US Airways pilots realize that Mr. Bradford’s goals are unattainable, LOA 93 will be a reality for the east pilots.

Previously covered within this page, from a long-ago, now standard west "Blessing"...fully replete with the fraternal concern for "fellow pilots" we've all come to know and love from your bunch = "You can live on LOA93 forever!!" 🙄

Don't you have anything less insipid, perhaps even new, at least in any way creative, and hopefully, even interestingly vile and contempatable to wish upon all in the east? Heck...you're already running up against a "Virus" on this same page, for the purposes of assaulting-the-easties-honors.

Is that truly the best you've got? I'm almost waxing nostalgic for "I want the captain seat..and most of all, I want every single east pilot to pay for it!!"

Aww heck. In the fullest spirit of brotherhood...you could at least toss a "Booyooshaka!" or two 🙄

 

[EastUS]

QUOTE (EastUS @ Nov 12 2008, 10:12 PM)
Perhaps it requires excessive mental agility to read and understand that the "union graft" was referencing Alpa's tenure...?

Quite possibly true.

Try actually reading it..then get back to us all.

"Hey Rocky!!..Watch me pull a Rabbit/anti-east/Rabbit outta' my hat!!".."Aww..but that trick never works" 🙄

 

[Metroyet]

However.....Umm...As a "Group"?...As far as I'm concerned..and I'm but one vote and minor voice...the west has fully worn out it's welcome for me. Merely note your pathetic little venemous "Virus" above, toss in a few taunts about being "A coward"

Be honest. Put yourself in a West guys position for a minute. They had a real union, they had procedures, they had contractual protections and dual ratification, they had benefits, insurance, and a real aeromedical system, and real reps that were not slaves to a totally rigged system on and on. Also, they sure as hell didn't need to be rescued from the abyss like you guys.

Your group stripped all of that away by force because something didn't go your way, (at least in your minds)

You write C&BLs with the benefit of hindsight specifically crafted to screw the west.

Susie finds a gap and exploits it. You guys use the majority again to close it and far beyond that, you add in all kinds of ominous provisions that end up with more fines and legal bills. You guys are withholding no effort to paint the West into a corner that they can't get out of. This fake union is starting to look a hell of a lot like military state run by dictators. There isn't a union in existence that resembles USAPA and that fact alone should give even the most hardcore USAPA fan reason to pause.

Now, like a sadistic playground bully you revel in the fact that you may be able to have someones career destroyed because they refuse to pay you for all of the atrocities that you are unfailing bringing upon them. Of course, it's just been an idle threat for now, nobody has been fired. Putting a gun to the Wests head to join the union is like rounding up a bunch of rattlesnakes to take to bed with you. Here's what you guys don't seem to get, you don't need our money. It might make the bully in you happy to see somebody pay for something they never purchased, but you don't need the money. You NEED SOLIDARITY and right now, among your group you have it. You'll be throwing it away for some extra cash that will be useless to your cause.

Frankly, I'm surprised no one has gotten seriously hurt yet. God forbid. The west played by the rules and when you heap the kinds of injustice on the innocent, and totally disenfranchise them, as USAPA is attempting to do, a flash point could very well erupt in someone. I fear it's just a matter of time if this keeps up. I guess that's the reason for the metal detectors and armed guards at the Phoenix meetings.

Think about that...cops and metal detectors...and you think you're going to get a contract? EVER? Unity is the only weapon a union has. Let's just say you guys are bringing a toothpick to a gunfight with management.


Maybe it is time to join. What's the harm? Besides, there is more than enough evidence from the last 8 months of what USAPAs true intentions are and how the West will behave. The class action lawasuits have been filed and are well underway. At this point nobody is stupid enough to believe that a bunch of West members equates to the West capitulating to the will of the East...that's how the braintrust will try and spin it but nobody will fall for it. Maybe this form of resistance has run it's course and perhaps it really is time to go Stage II viral on USAPA. Joining has no bearing on the DFR anyway.


As far as the virus thing goes, what in the hell did you actually expect? Nobody is going to give USAPA the satisfaction of stealing their job. In this economy, nobody is going to Risk unemployment over a few hundred dollars. If it comes down to it everybody will join, even the objectors. Then, you have a real problem on your hands. I can only imagine how much more clear a DFR will be once that happens as USAPA will now be presented with vastly more opportunities to step in it...and they will,. They have, without fail, from inception.

The West will never comply with any mandates from USAPA, you want to pervert the rules and twist them into something they were never intended? You want to hide behind the RLA while you go about your destructive business? Fine, guess what? Two can play that game and that game will be played until either this company is gone or USAPA is dead. You guys have underestimated the tenacity of the West from day 1 and you continue to do so.

Your organization was founded on injustice. Therefore, you will never succeed. You will never get a contract. USAPAs foundation is rotten to the core and it will support nothing but the pie in the sky dreams of the angry FO club.


It's time to bring the insurrection to a whole new level.

Where do I sign up "union" brother...

fraternally in Solidarity,
Metro.

 

[EastUS]

You guys have underestimated the tenacity of the West from day 1.

Yawn....

Have fun/Good luck

 

[V1cut]

Hmmm. Interesting change of heart there Metroyet.

I presume the court will forward your complaints/class actions/etc to the NMB then, right?

After all, the NMB has jurisdiction over all NMB sanctioned unions and their "litigation"...no?

And since all applicants have been approved, seems the venue just changed for ya....and those who haven't applied to USAPA have a different fate in their future.

yawn.

 

[V1cut]

Susie finds a gap and exploits it. You guys use the majority again to close it and far beyond that, you add in all kinds of ominous provisions that end up with more fines and legal bills. You guys are withholding no effort to paint the West into a corner that they can't get out of.


Joining has no bearing on the DFR anyway.


The West will never comply with any mandates from USAPA,

It's time to bring the insurrection to a whole new level.

Where do I sign up "union" brother...

fraternally in Solidarity,
Metro.

Susie got a reprieve from the inevitable, thats all. None of you have to join, but thats up to you.
I think you may find your lawsuits just found a new home, the NMB..."members" of a union under the NMB use that forum....not Judge Wapner.

And of course the west will comply with ALL mandates from USAPA, who are you kidding? The only horsepower you can ever hope to have is a vote in things, and that will go away the minute you start getting "uppity" again.

sleep on that, cowboy.

 

[Metroyet]

Susie got a reprieve from the inevitable, thats all. None of you have to join, but thats up to you.
I think you may find your lawsuits just found a new home, the NMB..."members" of a union under the NMB use that forum....not Judge Wapner.

And of course the west will comply with ALL mandates from USAPA, who are you kidding? The only horsepower you can ever hope to have is a vote in things, and that will go away the minute you start getting "uppity" again.

sleep on that, cowboy.

Your threats bore me.

Also, it's not "cowboy" it's "UNION BROTHER"

in Fratricidal Solidarity,

Metro.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Alpa seemd...to be merely an incestuous little "sewing" circle-jerk of career "politicians"..divorced from much, if any, actual line flying, much less the concerns of line pilots...and apparently existed almost entirely for only their own selfish agendas.

I think this is the technical definition of ALPA found buried somewhere in the secret preamble to their C&BLs.

The "Holy Grail" within Alpa was eventual placement amongst herndon's upper echelon politicians/parasites, who were/are literally making themselves millionaires at line pilots' expense everywhere, while doing NOTHING to stem the continued erosion of the quality of life and general benefits of the the piloting profession....unless one counts such "benefits" as the wholesale surrenduring of pensions/wages/health coverage/work rules/etc...

...and this is the introduction to the ALPA Policy and Procedures Manual

 

[V1cut]

Your threats bore me.

Then you'll really love this little reminder:

USAPA CODE OF ETHICS
I will faithfully discharge the duty I owe the Association, which makes possible my way of life.
I will respect other officers, committee members, employees and members of the Association remembering that respect does not entail subservience. I will do all within my powers to discharge my duties efficiently and in a manner that will not cause unnecessary delays or expense.
I will faithfully adhere to the policies, directives, and resolutions of the membership and the Board of Pilot Representatives. I will realize that as a representative of the Association, I will at all times keep my personal appearance and conduct above reproach. I will direct any criticism or proposed changes to the proper authorities within the Association. I will hold the Association’s business secrets in confidence, and will take care that they are not improperly revealed. In dealing with others I will expect efficient performance, yet I will refrain from unnecessary and destructive criticism. I will conduct my affairs with the Association in such a manner as to bring credit to the Association and to myself. I will conduct my affairs with the Association and its members in accordance with the rules laid down in the Constitution and Bylaws of the Association. I shall refrain from taking advantage of the confidence placed in me by my fellow members. If I am called upon to represent the Association in any dispute, I will do so to the best of my ability, fairly and vigorously, relying on the influence and power of the Association to protect me. I will not publish articles, give interviews, or permit my name to be used in any manner likely to bring discredit to the Association. I will continue to keep abreast of labor developments so that my skill and judgment, which heavily depend on such knowledge, may be of the highest order.
I will endeavor to my utmost to faithfully fulfill the obligations of the US Airline Pilots Association Code of Ethics.

hmmm. The virus-killer.

 

[tazz]

Then you'll really love this little reminder:

USAPA CODE OF ETHICS
I will faithfully discharge the duty I owe the Association, which makes possible my way of life.

This bores me and makes me want to barf.


QUOTE EDITED BY MODERATOR:

REMINDER: DO NOT quote lengthy posts, ESPECIALLY when your response is adjacent to or on the same page as what you are responding to.

 

[Metroyet]

Then you'll really love this little reminder:

USAPA CODE OF ETHICS

Hysterical Oxymoron...

 

[V1cut]

Your threats bore me.

Also, it's not "cowboy" it's "UNION BROTHER"

in Fratricidal Solidarity,

Metro.

Quite right..'brother".

(until you get yourself reduced to maintenance dues payer/non-voter status)

At which point you become irrelevent.

I'd like to be wrong about that, but I doubt it, just a matter of time, I suspect.

 

[V1cut]

Anyway, it'll be nice to send this all to the NMB, and then we can concentrate on securing a new contract from Doug...I expect he's in no hurry, but it's much more important than hypothesizing about union members and their status...that will take care of itself.